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Mazda 6 and Ford Fusion 2.3L Engine Swap

Update 3: More tweaks to the article. Added info on the intake camshaft & timing wheel/cog which seems to be causing some confusion.

Update 2: Added a FAQ sections for all the common questions about this swap. Also made some minor tweaks to the article.

Update 1: It has been over a year and 17,000 miles since the engine swap and the Fusion motor is still running great. I've added some more info to the guide - about timing covers, intake camshaft timing cog, and the cylinder head temp sensor.

Today we are going to show you how to swap your broken Mazda 2.3L engine with a cheaper and often times lower mileage Ford Fusion 2.3L engine. If you don't know by now, the Mazda 6, the Ford Fusion, and the Mercury Milan have the same exact engine (with few minor differences). Why would you even want an engine from a Ford Fusion? Well, it's about $1300 cheaper than the Mazda part.

The car in this article is a 2006 Mazda 6 with the 2.3L engine that has a rod knock. A search for the replacement engine turned up some interesting results - on average, a used 2.3L Mazda engine was around $2000 with over 100,000 miles on it. The same engine from the Fusion was priced between $700 - $1200, depending on the mileage. The engine that we are going to swap in this article came from a 2006 Ford Fusion, had 46,000 miles on it and cost $1,100. If you shop around you can land a great deal.

You may be wondering where to buy these engines. Obviously you can't just run over to your local Napa or AutoZone for something like this. Your first and best option is to use www.ebay.com. You can check out photos of the engine, look at the sellers feedback, and contact them directly. Most of the time they will list "freight" as the shipping method, meaning that the engine has to be shipped somewhere that has a dock. If you're a home mechanic, don't worry, you can still contact the seller and ask if they can ship to a residential address. Some will agree to do this, especially if they are located within a few hours from you.

Your second option is to use www.car-part.com. Most auto salvage yards list all of their inventory on here so you have a lot of options. Unfortunately you can't see any photos of the engine and you will have to call the yard and workout shipping and payment.

Ford Vs Mazda

Remember the part about a "few minor differences"? Here they are.

Ignition setup - In 2003 - 2004 the Mazda 6 had spark plugs, spark plug wires, and one ignition coil-pack that drove the four spark plugs. In 2005 the Mazda 6 used two versions of the ignition system, the old style spark plug wires plus one coil-pack and also a new individual coil-on-plug system. Note: these coils were the round style. In 2006 - 2008 the Mazda 6 2.3 exclusively used the coil-on-plug system and the coils were the square style. The Fusion 2.3 used the square style coil-on-plug system.

Intake Camshaft - While the actual intake camshafts looks very similar between the Mazda and Fusion 2.3, there is one very small but very important difference - the timing wheel/cog that is at the end of the camshaft. The 2003 - 2005 Mazda 6 had five teeth on the timing wheel/cog while the Fusion and 2006+ Mazda 6 had six teeth. Not only is the number of teeth different but so is the layout. Below you will see a photo of the Fusion timing wheel/cog. I have also included a layout diagram of the differences between the Fusion, the 03-05 and the 06+ Mazda 6 & Mazda 3. 2.3 timing cog 2.3 timing cog

Note #1: The timing wheel/cog is pressed on to the camshaft and is able to rotate if you put enough force on it.

Note #2: A couple of people in the comments section have found that the JDM Fusion 2.3 engines actually have five teeth on the timing wheel instead of six. In addition, they found that the timing wheel was clocked differently and as a result had to be rotated 1/8 of an inch counterclockwise. The air intake ports on the JDM engines are 1/4 inch taller and will not seal correctly with the stock intake gasket, leaving a small gap. Check out the comments by Steve Krause and Zane for all the details.

Oil Pan and Oil Pressure Sensor - The Mazda 03 - 05 2.3L engines had a tube for the oil dipstick on the side of the oil pan. The dipstick was routed to the outside of the engine. The later 06-08 Mazda engines routed the dipstick through the inside of the engine and out the top through the valve cover. All the Fusion & Milan 2.3L engines have the dipstick routed through the engine. The oil pressure sensors are different between the Fusion and the Mazda so they have to be swapped. Physically they look the same but they function differently. If you use the Fusion oil pressure sensor it will cause the oil light to come on.

Valve Cover - The early Mazda engines had metal valve covers. The later 06+ Mazda and Fusion 2.3 engines use a plastic cover with a hole for the oil dipstick.

Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Position Sensor - The Mazda 2.3L and the Ford 2.3L have different crankshaft pulleys (number and layout of the timing teeth don't match) and different crankshaft position sensors (one is three wire and the other one is two wire). The Mazda 6 2003 - 2005 also used a different crankshaft sensor than the Mazda 6 2006-2008 (sensors have different mounting points).

Front Timing Cover - Because of the different mounting points for the crankshaft position sensor, the front timing covers are different between the 03 - 05 and the 06+ Mazda 6 (See Brian's comment at the bottom of the page). The Fusion uses the same timing timing cover as the later (06-08) Mazda engines. In addition the 03 - 05 timing cover has oil passages inside of it that are not present on the later 06+ Mazda and Fusion timing covers.

Cylinder Head Temperature sensor - The Ford version of the 2.3L has a cylinder head temperature sensor located on top of the engine.

What does this all mean? Basically, if you have the newer 06-08 Mazda 6 with the coil-on-plug setup then swapping to a Fusion engine is a breeze - the parts that you have to reuse from your old engine are the crankshaft pulley, crank position sensor, and oil pressure sensor. If you have an older 03 - 05 Mazda 6 then there is more work involved - you will have to reuse and swap your ignition system (spark plugs, wires, and coil pack), intake camshaft (because it has a different timing cog), crankshaft pulley, crankshaft position sensor, oil pressure sensor, front timing cover, and camshaft position sensor.

In all cases, when you are doing a 2.3L engine swap, you need to open the valve covers on both of the engines and inspect/compare the timing cogs on the intake camshafts. If the layout of the teeth on the cogs is different between the engines then you know that you will have to swap the intake cams.

You will want to reuse your Mazda wiring harness. It is also a good idea to stick with your Mazda intake manifold and the throttle body.

Frequently Asked Questions

What year of the Fusion engine can I use for the swap? - The Fusion used the 2.3 engine in years 2006 - 2009. Any of those will work. When searching for a Fusion engine you may see some places mentioning production date pre or post Dec 06. Either will work in this case. If in doubt, go for the newest engine that you can afford.

Will a Fusion engine from an automatic work with my manual car or vice versa? - It is the exact same engine with the exception that for manual cars there is a pilot bearing that is installed in the rear of the crankshaft. So if you have a manual Mazda and you got a Fusion engine from an automatic car you will need to install a pilot bearing. Don't bother transferring over your old pilot bearing - it is a $10 part and should probably be replaced anyway.

I have a 2006 or up Mazda 6. Can I swap in an older (03 - 05) Mazda 2.3 engine? - In a nutshell, no. Older Mazda 2.3 engines have timing covers which contain oil passages. These oil passages are not present in the timing covers of newer (06 and up) Mazda 2.3 engines. See nojodas67's comment for more details.

Will the Fusion 2.3 swap work on my Mazda 3 2.3 car? - It will but you will need to swap oil pans in addition to all the other items. Finally, the alternator will mount with only 3 bolts. See Joel's comments for more details.

Will the Fusion 2.3 engine work in my turbo Mazdaspeed 3 or 6? - No. The Mazdaspeed engine has a totally different cylinder head to accommodate direct injection. The Fusion engine block lacks, among other things, machining for the turbo oil feed and return lines.

Overview

The car in this guide is a 2006 Mazda 6, which means that we have to reuse the Mazda crankshaft pulley and crankshaft position sensor. As far as engine swaps go, this is probably one of the easier swaps that you can do because there is so much room to work with. There are several ways of removing the engine from the car. You can drop the sub-frame and lower the engine from the bottom. Some people take off the front bumper and radiator and slide the engine forward. The last method is to use an engine hoist (crane) and lift it out. Personally, I hate working with the sub-frame and since I have an engine hoist, going from the top is my preferred method.

While this guide covers cars that are equipped with the manual transmission you can still follow along if you have an automatic. There are a few different steps that you have to take that will be covered in this guide.

Finally, there is more than one way to take out this engine - you do not have to do all of the steps in the order that is written here.

How to Swap the Mazda 2.3L with the Ford Fusion 2.3L - Removal

1. Put the front end of the car on jack stands.

2. Remove the bottom engine cover, aka under-body cover.

3. You will need to remove the hood. It's held on with four bolts at the hinges. Its not that heavy and if you have long arms you can even take it out by yourself. Also remove the top plastic engine cover - it is snapped into place so just pull on it to remove it. mazda 6 hood removal

4. There is a lot going on in the photo below but its all fairly easy to remove.

  • a - disconnect the MAF sensor.
  • b - disconnect the variable air duct (VAD) control solenoid (green connector).
  • c - disconnect the small vacuum hose from the air-box.
  • d - disconnect thecrankcase vent tube at the valve cover that goes from the valve cover to the accordion.
  • e - the air-box is also snapped into place at the bottom so all you have to do is loosen the clamp on the accordion tube and pull on the air-box to lift the whole thing out.
  • f - finally, disconnect the battery cables. Remove the battery and the battery tray.
mazda 6 engine bay

5. Later on you will have to unfasten the power-steering pump and the ac compressor so you need to remove the serpentine belt. Use a wrench on the tensioner and rotate it clockwise to create slack in the belt. The easiest way to get to the tensioner is from the bottom of the car through the wheel well. mazda 6 2.3L tensioner pulley

6. Drain the coolant. On the bottom of the radiator there will be a drain hole. Turn counter clockwise and have something ready to catch the coolant. Remove the cap from the coolant over flow reservoir to help the coolant flow easier. mazda 6 coolant drain

7. Okay, so you have the battery and air-box out of the way. Now it's time to remove a bunch of hoses and tubes.

  • blue - depress the locking ring and disconnect the brake booster vacuum supply tube from the intake manifold. You can also disconnect it from the firewall and rotate it around, leaving plugged into the intake.
  • yellow - this is the fuel line. Held in place with a quick-disconnect. Make sure all the fuel pressure is relieved before removing this! You can relieve fuel pressure by taking out the fuel pump fuse and starting your car. This will use up all the remaining fuel in the lines. You can also just leave your car alone for a few days and the fuel pressure will decrease on its own.
  • green - this is the evap tube. It has quick disconnects on both ends (one at the throttle body and the other one at the firewall). Remove the whole tube along with the purge solenoid valve (has the black plug - disconnect the cable from it first).
  • cyan - small coolant line, disconnect from the radiator side and you can just leave this connected to the engine.
  • red - coolant line. Provided that the coolant has been drained, remove this hose completely as it just gets in the way.
mazda 6 fuel line evap line

8. There are two wiring harnesses in the engine bay. The main harness which will stay with the engine as its lifted out and the secondary harness that is connected to the injectors and the transmission. This secondary harness stays with the car so you will have to disconnect a few connectors before moving it aside. Look below and disconnect the appropriate plugs on the harness. mazda 6 harness removal

9. A few more things to remove here.

  • a - the shift cables are held in place with weak "paper clips". Press back both sides and rotate the metal clip up. Then just pull up on the shift cable to disengage it.
  • b - there are two bolts holding the shift cable bracket. Remove these and you can then move the shift cables (with the bracket) aside.
  • c - two more plugs that you have to disconnect in order to free up the secondary harness. Also remove the bolt that secures the blue grounding cable.

If you have an automatic transmission you will have a selector lever cable instead of the shift cables. You will also have two lines for the transmission fluid that you will have to disconnect (have something ready to catch the fluid that leaks out). mazda 6 shift cable removal

10. You can see in the photo below that I have the shift cables out of the way. Couple more things do to:

  • green - move the secondary harness out of the way.
  • cyan - undo the clamps and disconnect the heater hoses. There will be some coolant left over in these so have a cup or something else to catch the fluid if you dont want to make a mess.
mazda 6 heater hose removal

Comments

Brian 10-22-2013 12:36
Completed this engine swap '06 fuzion motor to '05 6 with automatic transmission, so everything had to be swapped (crank pulley, crank sensor, timing cover, oil pan, intake cam, valve cover, and all ignition stuff). Because the crank pulley and sensors are different the crank sensor mounts in different spots, which means you have to swap the front timing cover. I swapped the oil pans while doing the timing cover. I used permatex gray on both covers. I found and downloaded a factory manual , which helped with torque settings and setting timing. The studs for the alternator had to be removed from the fuzion motor. Torque converter bolts are loosened through the starter hole.
Just an observation, with the timing cover off i was able to inspect the guides and tensioner on my motor with 117k and the new one with 55k. 117k motor showed 6 teeth out on the tensioner and only 3 on the 55k.

Thank you for putting the guide together and hosting, I wouldn't have bought the fuzion engine without it, which saved me quite a bit of money.
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Artem Vestsorov 10-22-2013 23:00
Brian,

Thanks for that valuable info on the different crankshaft position sensors. I looked up the parts and sure enough, the mounting points are different between the two sensors which would explain the need to swap timing covers.
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thomas 09-28-2014 23:04
I followed this guide to swap a 2011 fusion 2.5l into a 2004 mazda 3 2.3l. Engine runs awsome so much more torque. I swapped everything listed plus the little heater hose connector box mounted above the tranny as that was different. No cels except for intake cam timing. Didn't use the timing tools my bad. But it still purrs like a kitten.
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Jason 01-18-2015 06:48
I see you put a 2.5 in your mazda 3 Did your mazda intake manifold bolt on with no problems? or did you use the ford one?
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Veera 02-05-2015 03:12
Hi Thomas,

Did your car has Automatic or Manual Transmission? Your words gave me confidence to swap my ceased 2.3L engine from Mazda 3 2005 using Ford Fusion one. The only thing I was wondering is about the transmission and would greatly appreciated if you could reply.

Thanks.
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mike 05-14-2015 11:15
Is there any difference between doing this in a 2003 mazda 6? What gasket did you use for intake? Or can I use the fusion intake??.

Thank you
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Fernando Rios 10-13-2014 10:06
I had a question,im doing the engine swap as well.im putting a 2008 fusion engine 2.3 into my 2005 mazda 6. I know i have to change the intake cam,but i noticed that the intake cam sprockets are different as well.the fuzion one has the teeth a little more spread apart then the mazda one.do i put the fuzion intake cam sprocket on the mazda shaft, or do i leave it how it is and put the mazda sprocket with the cam on the fuzion engine.
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ng 10-13-2014 21:41
Just take camshaft from Mazda engine and put it on Fusion engine ...make sure you have tools to lock crankshaft and camshaft together I made my ....
I did this swap no long ago , let me know if you have any question I did in 2007 mazda5,
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Fernando Rios 10-14-2014 01:15
so i want to make sure i did this correct. when i went to swap the intake cam i noticed that the chain and sprocket for the intake cam were different from the fuzion engine. So what i did was take the intake camshaft from the mazda engine and took out the sprocket where the chain goes, after that i put the fuzion intake cam sprocket on the mazda camshaft so that the chain and everything would fit since both cars use different size chains. Is this correct. Long story short i used the mazda camshaft only, but i put the fuzion sprocket on the mazda camshaft so that the timing chain would work.
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nojodas67 10-14-2014 01:35
Yes, if you had read the guide carefully, that is exactly what you have to do: replace the intake camshaft, and only the camshaft (not the sprockets, chains, etc).
Make sure you follow the timing procedure carefully and use the proper tools.
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Fernando Rios 10-14-2014 01:56
one last thing to make sure im correct. i noticed that the timing covers are different. the fuzion does the variable timing inside the head, while the mazda does it through the timing cover. Since i have to swap the covers i noticed that the passageways inside on mazda cover for variable timing isnt needed because the fuzion engine does it inside the head. So what i did was seal the passageways on the mazda timing cover to prevent any possible pressure lost in the timing cover. is this okay to do ?
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nojodas67 10-14-2014 13:29
Quoting Fernando Rios:
one last thing to make sure im correct. i noticed that the timing covers are different. the fuzion does the variable timing inside the head, while the mazda does it through the timing cover. Since i have to swap the covers i noticed that the passageways inside on mazda cover for variable timing isnt needed because the fuzion engine does it inside the head. So what i did was seal the passageways on the mazda timing cover to prevent any possible pressure lost in the timing cover. is this okay to do ?

The 2008 Mazda block does not send oil through the timing cover passage. You will not lose oil pressure there. Just put the Mazda timing cover on the Fusion engine, the oil will pass through the block up to the head via the head gasket and to the VVT solenoid.
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nojodas67 10-14-2014 13:38
If it makes you feel better, you can always block that hole or verify that the passage does not go anywhere. Try to blow air into that hole with an air compressor and see if it's blocked, it should be. If you hear air escaping somewhere in the engine, then just block the hole. (you can use a rubber stopper, a piece of gasket material, a piece of cork, etc.)
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Fernando Rios 10-14-2014 14:13
so i blew air into the hole and leads up to the vvt solenoid. I noticed as well that mazda and fuzion engines have the hole but for the mazda engine the whole is little higher up on the head, which alligns with the oil passages on the mazda timing cover. The fuzion engine also has the hole but its a little lower than the whole on the mazda engine. When i put the fuzion timing cover on the fuzion engine i noticed that the hole is completely sealed shut. The problem im having is that since the timing covers are a little different, when i put the mazda timing cover on the fuzion engine, that hole is not sealed shut, it stays exposed. I do not want to loose pressure with the vvt solenoid.
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Fernando Rios 10-14-2014 14:16
to make it a little clear my mazda is a 2005. im putting a 2008 fuzion engine on it.
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michael 02-06-2015 04:13
did you get this figured out? i also have a 05 and im going to be buying a fusion engine soon.
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Andy 01-21-2016 16:49
Hi, nojodas . I have a 2006 mazda 3 2.3L with independent coil system. I bought it drove it 2 weeks and the engine blew on it. :( . I dont have a lot of experience with engines but i spent hours on end learning. After trial n error with 2 engines so far i decided to wait for the "right" engine at our local autowrecker. Could you please let me know which one that is?. So ive read through all your posts and i figure the timing plate cover option is a bit hard for my exp level. Obviously the mazda 2006 2.3 is an easy match. Could you tell me which other mazda years/models also which ford years / models im looking for? I want to avoid messing with the timing or to have to replace the intake camshaft . Please explain with necessary detail, if any, what should i "hunt" for to get my car on the road as easy and as soon as possible as considering im a beginner. Also ive had sum people advising me to take the harness and PCU from the donor car. What do u think about that? Thanx a milion in advance for sharing your knowlege with all of us on this forum.
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nojodas67 01-25-2016 03:15
Quoting Andy:
Hi, nojodas . I have a 2006 mazda 3 2.3L with independent coil system. I bought it drove it 2 weeks and the engine blew on it. :( . I dont have a lot of experience with engines but i spent hours on end learning. After trial n error with 2 engines so far i decided to wait for the "right" engine at our local autowrecker. Could you please let me know which one that is?. So ive read through all your posts and i figure the timing plate cover option is a bit hard for my exp level. Obviously the mazda 2006 2.3 is an easy match. Could you tell me which other mazda years/models also which ford years / models im looking for? I want to avoid messing with the timing or to have to replace the intake camshaft . Please explain with necessary detail, if any, what should i "hunt" for to get my car on the road as easy and as soon as possible as considering im a beginner. Also ive had sum people advising me to take the harness and PCU from the donor car. What do u think about that? Thanx a milion in advance for sharing your knowlege with all of us on this forum.

Andy,
I'm replying to your questions at the very bottom of this section, so it's easier to find.
So scroll down to the end of this page.
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Fernando Rios 10-14-2014 12:49
i ran into a complication, i noticed when comparing timing covers that the oil passage is different and i get that, but when i look at the fuzion block where the timing cover goes, theres a hole where the fuzion timing cover seals up that goes with the vvt,but when i put the mazda cover on it, it leaves the hole almost exposed. What does that mean ? is my vvt going to stop working, because the fuzion timing cover covers it up completely like blocking it, but the mazda timing cover doesnt has that on the cover so it leaves the hole completely open. help please ?
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nojodas67 10-14-2014 14:25
Your concerns are well warranted, however, I've not heard of anyone having an issue with their VVT not engaging or losing oil pressure after swapping timing covers and NOT blocking the hole, so I stopped doing it. In my first few swaps, I've blocked this hole because I had the same concerns as you, but it did not seem to make the car run any better or worse if I did not block the hole. I've done over a dozen of these swaps and blocked that hole 2 or 3 times only. You can go ahead and block the hole if you like, for your own piece of mind.
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Fernando Rios 10-14-2014 15:22
alright thank you so much for the help, you saved me so much stress and potential problems, i now have a piece of mind.
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Rick smith 10-06-2015 14:55
I have 06 mazda 3, 2.3l manual tran. I have 05 2.3l motor with manual trany, I want to install. What parts do I need to swap out cam sensor etc.
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Joe 02-25-2017 03:44
Hi i have a quick question. I have a 2004 mt and i bought a 2006 At of which i am mounting the manual tranny on all i need to do is change the cam,oilpan and timing cover do i need to change the harmonic balancer due to the tranny change and what should i do as a result of the different crankshft postioing sensor plug as i would like to use the original 2004 harness more questions to come
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tkydone 03-14-2015 15:37
Hello all
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Jason Williams 08-22-2016 03:48
Quoting Brian:
Completed this engine swap '06 fuzion motor to '05 6 with automatic transmission, so everything had to be swapped (crank pulley, crank sensor, timing cover, oil pan, intake cam, valve cover, and all ignition stuff). Because the crank pulley and sensors are different the crank sensor mounts in different spots, which means you have to swap the front timing cover. I swapped the oil pans while doing the timing cover. I used permatex gray on both covers. I found and downloaded a factory manual , which helped with torque settings and setting timing. The studs for the alternator had to be removed from the fuzion motor. Torque converter bolts are loosened through the starter hole.
Just an observation, with the timing cover off i was able to inspect the guides and tensioner on my motor with 117k and the new one with 55k. 117k motor showed 6 teeth out on the tensioner and only 3 on the 55k.

Thank you for putting the guide together and hosting, I wouldn't have bought the fuzion engine without it, which saved me quite a bit of money.



Lookin at doin this swap on my 05 mazda 6. Says the factory 05 timing cover has oil passages. How does this play in when swappin it to a fusion engine?

Any and all info would b greatly appreciated

Email is
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Leslie 10-28-2013 17:39
Ok I'm looking to do a swap from a 2004 Mazda 6 2.3L 4Cyl to the 2007 Ford Fusion 2.3L 4cyl. The shops in my area ask if the production date is pre or post Dec 06. I don't want to give away what I'm doing for fear they will raise the price, but I can't find anywhere what the difference is. Any advice? Will either switch or do I need to have the pre Dec 06 one? Thanks
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Artem Vestsorov 10-29-2013 20:29
Yes, for some reason the part number for the engine assembly changed between 2006 and 2007. What are the differences? I honestly don't know. I do know that all the specs are exactly the same between the two years. So I am positive that either year will work. I've heard of people using the 07 engine and I used a 06 for this guide. Just be aware that since you have a 2004 Mazda 6 that there is more work involved when doing this swap (read the comment above yours).
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Leslie 11-01-2013 14:27
I know the Ford Fusions and Mercury Milan are the same, have you done the swap with the Milan? I've got a great deal on a 09 Milan. Yes I know we have the older Mazda that requires a little more work. I've done several engine swaps but mostly older cars that don't have the computer and emisson stuff. Usually newer cars I use the same engines for the swap, just can't afford the Mazda one.
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Nojodas67 11-01-2013 14:32
I have a good motor out of a 2003 Mazda6 with just 75k miles, you could just drop it in without modifying anything. Where are you located?
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Leslie 11-01-2013 14:52
Charlotte, NC... but if you've done several of these swaps and always used the fusions like your comment says why would you offer a Mazda engine knowing you can get good money for it? Just curious
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Nojodas67 11-01-2013 15:49
I wasn't offering it as a gift but I was going to give you a good price for it, before I listed it on Ebay; or I was just going to put it on the shelf until I found a pre-2005 Mazda to put it in.
I was hoping I didn't have to go through a lengthy explanation but the question is understandable so here it goes: There are basically 2 generation of these motors, I call it "early" and "later" versions, and the cutoff was in mid 2005. In the early version, the VVT is fed through an oil passage that runs through the timing cover, so it is critical that these oil passages are piped correctly and leak-free on early model Mazda's. On later versions the VVT is fed directly through the head, so there is no oil flow within the timing cover at all. So basically, you can put an early model timing cover on a later model Fusion engine, but not vice-versa. So I cannot install this engine on 2006 or newer Mazda's that requires the larger crank wheel and updated crank sensor. Well I could and I have done it once (installed a 2004 engine on a 2006 car), but a slight modification is required, I have to plug an oil hole in the front of the head; the engine ran well and had good oil pressure. It never gave a CEL, but when the ecm calls for the VVT solenoid to open, it does but without oil pressure the intake valve timing does not change, so it basically renders the VVT inoperable.
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Nojodas67 11-01-2013 15:50
(con't)
Most people will not ever feel the VVT solenoid when it kicks on anyway, but I'd just rather put this other "early version" engine I have in the correct model year car; it does have low miles after all and I just got it back from the machine shop with a fresh valve job; it has 185 psi. on all 4 cylinders.
Most of the dead or knocking Mazda's I'm buying now are 2006 or later, so I could either sell this engine to someone that can use it NOW, or just sit on it until I find an early 2005 or older Mazda to put it in; it makes no difference to me. I currently have 3 later Fusion engines on the shelf, and 2 dead cars to put them into, so this is just another extra engine for me.
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Leslie 11-01-2013 16:42
When I say offer when you can get good money I mean that is $1500 difference between the Mazda and Fusion engines, so no matter what kind of a deal you give thats a big "offer". And yeah I know the difference between the earlier and later versions thats why I'm trying to figure out if the Milans match up. I'm trying to save some money, I don't mind the extra time for me it's not like I'm paying someone else's labor it just how much longer I drive my back up while I do the swap because I do love the Mazda and would love to get back behind the wheel of it. So I guess I'll ask the question again has anyone tried the swap with a newer Milan engine? I know Mercury,Ford, and Mazda are the same but has the swap been done succesfully? I love this form shows how to the the swap with the Fusion but curious now about the Milan. But by all means if you want to sell the 03 Mazda engine for the price of the Fusion I'll take it, less work for me.
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Artem Vestsorov 11-02-2013 12:04
Leslie, the Milan is just a re-branded Fusion. As in the case of the Fusion, any 2.3L out a 2006 - 2009 Milan will work and everything about the Fusion swap applies to the Milan swap.
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Nojodas67 11-02-2013 14:00
Although I have not bought a Milan engine, I don't imagine there would be any difference between the Milan and Fusion swap. I just finished another Fusion swap last night.
About the Mazda engine, I'll sell it for $1,000. The last time I shipped an engine across a few states, it cost a couple hundred dollars to ship; no sales tax and no core charge so it sort of evens out vs buying locally.
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Jesse 06-29-2014 03:37
Do you still happen to have this early model engine I'm in Kansas and I am in need of a motor for an 03 mazda
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Ken 07-29-2014 17:32
[quote name="Nojodas67 " So I cannot install this engine on 2006 or newer Mazda's that requires the larger crank wheel and updated crank sensor. Well I could and I have done it once (installed a 2004 engine on a 2006 car), but a slight modification is required, I have to plug an oil hole in the front of the head; the engine ran well and had good oil pressure. It never gave a CEL, but when the ecm calls for the VVT solenoid to open, it does but without oil pressure the intake valve timing does not change, so it basically renders the VVT inoperable.

Can you please tell me which hole I need to plug? I am about to put a 2004 Mazda 3 engine into my sons 2006 Mazda 6 and I'm afraid it will not run after. PLEASE PLEASE help with any info you can.
Thanks
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Nojodas67 10-31-2013 15:03
I have done many of these swaps from many year Mazda6's (2002-2008) and always used Fusion engines. Depending on the year of your Mazda, on some older cars there is some more work and modification involved. I did the first swap by pulling the engine out the top like you did; on all the other swaps I removed the front bumper assembly, headlights and core support with cooling attached. It's a heck of a lot easier to do it that way since the engine can come out the front, instead of the top; and there's no need to disconnect the suspension on either side, since neither axle will have to come out. Also, the engine goes in all complete, including serpentine belt. Just disconnect the electrical wiring and set aside, disconnect the exhaust after the manifold, remove the starter and the torque converter nuts, remove the engine to trans bolts. Support the engine, remove the front engine mount (passenger side) and start pulling the engine. I don't want to take over your guide but you may want to update your instructions and/or pictures. I will be writing a thread that hopefully becomes a sticky with pictures, when my schedule allows.
John
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Artem Vestsorov 10-31-2013 20:27
Thanks for dropping by Nojodas67. One thing to watch out for when taking off the front end is that the ac lines have to be disconnect. To properly do that the person would have to evacuate the refrigerant that's currently in the system then when everything is reassembled, pull vacuum to remove any moisture and then recharge the system. In addition, there is a good chance that the o-rings in the lines may need to be replaced to prevent any leaks from forming.

I'm not bashing this method at all. My point is that there are multiple ways to do this swap and each one has its pluses and minuses. Just depends on what you want to tackle. I'm sure people will find your thread helpful - more information is always a good thing.

As for me, I have not done the swap by pulling the front end off so I can't really update anything since I don't have any new info or pictures.
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Nojodas67 11-01-2013 01:49
That's a good point too but if the person doing the swap does not have a recovery pump to evacuate the system, then he/she can take it to any shop and have it evacuated, then return to the shop when the work is completed to pull a vacuum and recharge with your own refrigerant. That should not cost more than an hour's labor charge, and will keep the tree-huggers happy as well. I have not had to replace any of the o-rings yet. Believe me, it sure beats having to remove the alternator, power steering pump, A/C compressor, exhaust manifold, intake manifold, starter, torque converter bolts...all while the engine is still in the car. I've done it both ways and pulling the front clip is much easier.
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Eric 01-07-2017 03:40
I removed the entire thing and removed the transmission from the engine outside. But the torque converter stayed with the engine and now I can't remove it. I removed the nuts and tried to gently pry it but it won't budge Andy ideas?
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nojodas67 01-07-2017 15:12
Quoting Eric:
I removed the entire thing and removed the transmission from the engine outside. But the torque converter stayed with the engine and now I can't remove it. I removed the nuts and tried to gently pry it but it won't budge Andy ideas?

The center quide shaft of the torque converter that goes into the flywheel is a very tight fit, so the torque converter has to come out straight. So if you pry on one side of the torque converter you have to apply an equal amount of pressure with another prybar on the opposite side. So with the engine sitting up and the cyl. head at 12 o'clock, put a pry bar between the torque converter and flywheel at 4 o'clock and another pry bat at 8 o'clock and gently pry out on both at the same time. If it still doesn't budge, then try prying at 6 & 12, 5&11, etc...until it comes loose.
Good luck. Let us know how it goes.
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Eric 01-13-2017 00:35
Ya it was just a tight fit! Thank you! I now need to go get the engine, I started disassembling first and have everything taken apart. I'm conflicted between buying a JDM engine for $800 with 50k miles or a fusion one for about $700. I really want to find one that will require the least amount of work. But I don't know exactly what engine I have, the one pre 05 or the 06 and up. In the article it shows that the o5 has 5 pegs on the camshaft but mine actually has 6 so I guess I'll just get whatever engine has 6 pegs so I don't have to replace that.
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nojodas67 01-13-2017 06:11
You have the 06 and later engine. If you get a Fusion engine (6 pegs) you will not have to swap camshafts but you still have to swap the crank pulley and reset the timing.

Whereas, If you get the JDM, it will just be a drop-in. But you should still count the teeth on the crank pulley to make sure they are the same or it won't work. Take a picture of your crank pulley with you at TDC when you go look at the JDM engine, so you don't go through all that work for nothing.

Good luck and let us know how it works out.
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Eric 01-13-2017 06:35
Quoting nojodas67:
You have the 06 and later engine. If you get a Fusion engine (6 pegs) you will not have to swap camshafts but you still have to swap the crank pulley and reset the timing.

Whereas, If you get the JDM, it will just be a drop-in. But you should still count the teeth on the crank pulley to make sure they are the same or it won't work. Take a picture of your crank pulley with you at TDC when you go look at the JDM engine, so you don't go through all that work for nothing.

Good luck and let us know how it works out.


The crank pully for the jdm engine is different than mine, it has teeth all around the pully and mine has two sets of teeth I don't know exactly if it's a different size pully or just looks different. Any how I'm thinking I'm going to have to replace it with the original. How do I go about readjusting the timing though? That's the thing that really gets me nervous. And thanks for all the help I really appreciate it!
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Salish 04-05-2017 19:38
We are currently trying to swap a 2010 fusion 2.5 into a 2003 mazda 6 that has a 2.3. The swap went smoothly, however we cant seem to have the car keep a spark. We are being told by everyone that we need to go have the mazda ecu tuned so that it registers the new engine. Have you come across this at all?
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Nojodas67 04-05-2017 21:23
Quoting Salish:
We are currently trying to swap a 2010 fusion 2.5 into a 2003 mazda 6 that has a 2.3. The swap went smoothly, however we cant seem to have the car keep a spark. We are being told by everyone that we need to go have the mazda ecu tuned so that it registers the new engine. Have you come across this at all?

What did you mean by "everyone"? I'm sure "everyone" has never done this swap and they are just guessing. I've done many of these swaps successfully (like many other people here) and I can tell you with 100% certainty that the ECM does NOT need to be programmed.
You need to make sure you are using all these parts from the Mazda: throttle body, crankshaft pulley wheel, intake camshaft, timing cover, etc. not the Fusion parts. The ECU gets spark signal from the crank sensor and the cam sensor.
Check your steps again and make sure none were skipped or done improperly.
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Turbod 11-07-2013 18:58
Hey I have a 2006 Mazda 3 wondering if its the same swap? Also My car has a manual trans do I have to get the engine from a car with a manual or will one from an auto work? Pilot bushing issues etc? Are the oil pans the same as well? Thanks!
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Artem Vestsorov 11-07-2013 22:27
Your Mazda 3 has the 2.3 right? If so, then it should be very similar since the 2.3 in the Mazda 3 is the same as the Mazda 6 and of course the Fusion. Your 2006 has the coil-on-plug ignition so you should not have to swap the intake cam (not 100% sure on this so open up the valve cover and compare the timing cogs). Your 2006 has the oil dipstick going through the inside of the engine so the oil pans should be the same. Crank pulley and sensor will have to be swapped.

As for manual vs auto - it doesn't matter. If you get an engine from an auto you will either have to reuse your original pilot bearing or buy and install a new one (that's what I did since the fusion engine in this guide was from an auto and I had a manual).

If you do end up doing this swap can you let me know how it turns out? I'm curious what, if any, difference there are.
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Turbod 11-08-2013 00:52
Yeah sorry my Mazda 3 does have the 2.3. I'm planning on picking up a fusion motor this weekend, once I start the swap I'll keep you posted.
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usmcels 11-09-2013 02:07
Am in the middle of swapping out a 2.3 ltr from a Mazda 6 2008.it amazes me the people out there,junk yards reman engine companies and so on, tell you that ONLY a mazda engine will work in a mazda and vice versa for fusion.I had ordered a Mazda motor from a big reputable company because I was told by them I had to.long story shorter, when I removed motor, from the top, I saw FORD stamps all over it including ford part numbers.doing a little digging found this site and pleasantly surprised. I canceled the motor order, waited 3weeks for my refund (cost of motor with shipping was $3075.) And ordered a newer, lower mileage fusion motor (34k) for only $1350!!!!! Did EXACTLY what you did for the crank pulley, sensor replacement and SUCCESS!!! Also I bought a auto tranny motor and have a manual, Installed pilot and perfect fit....Because of your website you saved my customer thousands of dollars.much appreciated for this post.
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Artem Vestsorov 11-09-2013 15:35
That's a hell of a success story! Thanks for sharing. As for the Ford stamp, it's not just on the engine, its everywhere - brake calipers, suspension component, etc...
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Mark 11-12-2013 03:06
Ok I did the mazda/fusion swap. Have you heard of the intake manifold not lining up causing a vacuum leak to all ports? It seems as if the manifold needs to be shifted up but can't because of the alignment pin and bolts? Any help would be great.
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Artem Vestsorov 11-12-2013 12:40
I've been following the fusion swap for a long time both on the forums and through doing my own swap. I have never heard of anyone saying that the intake manifold does not line up. I've looked at photos of fusion and mazda 2.3 intake manifolds and both have the mounting holes and alignment pins in the same positions.

You say it needs to be shifted up - lengthwise, how much are we talking about? Can you see a gap or something? Do the bolt holes and the alignment pins line up so that you can at least bolt the manifold down? Maybe your intake manifold gasket needs to be replaced?

Not saying that it's impossible but it just doesn't add up. What year is your mazda and what year is the fusion engine?
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Quinntin 12-20-2013 15:32
Hello, my head gasket went in my 06 Mazda 3 2.3l from what I can tell the 06 Mazda 6 and 3 engines are identical, am I correct? If so that would mean that this swap would work out the same as yours? Your advice would be helpful, and would save me paying 4400$ plus labour for a new motor
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nojodas67 12-20-2013 15:58
Quoting Quinntin:
Hello, my head gasket went in my 06 Mazda 3 2.3l from what I can tell the 06 Mazda 6 and 3 engines are identical, am I correct? If so that would mean that this swap would work out the same as yours? Your advice would be helpful, and would save me paying 4400$ plus labour for a new motor

If your problem is just a head gasket, assuming it has been diagnosed properly, you should just have the head gasket replaced, not the entire engine. I have rebuilt these engines entirely, they're not hard to do. But to answer your question, the engines are not identical, the crank pulley is different. You will be able to do the swap just like in a Mazda 6, but you will need to use your old crank pulley, your old intake camshaft if they are different, and re-set the valve timing.
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Eric 12-14-2016 21:19
I know this is years later from your comment but I had a question. Since you have experience with these engines do you know what the difference is between the Mazda engine with coil on boots and the one with a coil pack? I found a cheap jdm engine but it has a coil pack instead of coil on boots. Will the engine be an easy swap or is there other significant differences between them?
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nojodas67 12-15-2016 03:18
Quoting Eric:
I know this is years later from your comment but I had a question. Since you have experience with these engines do you know what the difference is between the Mazda engine with coil on boots and the one with a coil pack? I found a cheap jdm engine but it has a coil pack instead of coil on boots. Will the engine be an easy swap or is there other significant differences between them?

I'm not familiar about JDM engines. I know that used engines that are made for Japan market are not the same as the ones produced for the Americas, however, I don't know exactly what the differences are.
Sorry, I couldn't be of more help.
You are better off finding a low-mileage Fusion engine, which are readily available and much cheaper than Mazda engines, then do the swap following this guide.
Good luck.
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Joel Rodriguez 12-21-2013 04:59
I really need someones help. I have a 04 Mazda 3 and bought an 09 fusion 2.3 engine. Went to do the swap and nothing is mounting how its supposed to. Oil pan is different so ac compressor wont fit. Block is slightly different so alternator wont mount. Im at wits end

Stuck in fl. Bought this engine and pretty sure they WONT give me a refund. Can't swap my oil pan because its cracked, and probably wont find an oil pan on short notice. Alternator doesnt mount up properly, due to slight differences in the block. Tried google and found someone who seems to have had the same problem and supposedly mounted alternator minus one bolt but info was vague. If ANYONE can help me email me please. Running out of money for this and have to get back to NYC for xmas.
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nojodas67 12-21-2013 05:32
I have never done the swap on a Mazda3, but I've done about a dozen Mazda6's. I know that the Mazda3 has a different crank pulley, alternator bracket and the A/C compressor is mounted under the oil pan, instead of on the starter side. Anyway, how bad is your oil pan? You could try welding it. Any welding shop should be able to repair it, look for a local welder.
As far as the alternator, can't you just use the Fusion alternator? You can just splice the wires, it will basically perform the same function.
I don't have the car in front of me, but another idea would be to just install the Fusion motor with it's own accessories (if you got it complete), then swap out the parts once you get home.

I wish I could be of more help, but if you can find a welding shop locally, I'd go that route. I was thinking JB weld for the oil pan, but I don't think I would risk it for the long trip back to NY.
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Joel Rodriguez 12-23-2013 01:50
Got it!! Deleted A/C compressor temporarily. Alternator mounts with only 3 bolts. Timing was a bit of a headache. Driving home as we speak. Thanks for everything.
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nojodas67 12-23-2013 03:04
Quoting Joel Rodriguez:
Got it!! Deleted A/C compressor temporarily. Alternator mounts with only 3 bolts. Timing was a bit of a headache. Driving home as we speak. Thanks for everything.

Glad you got it figured out!! Make sure you use pure synthetic oil ONLY in that engine and change it at 3k intervals...tha t's the key to keeping these engines running for a long time.
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FNLN 12-30-2013 02:32
Thanks for the write up, my wife's '03 6 got out of time enough that the valves and pistons came together in 3 of 4 cylinders. My father in law is a long term customer at several salvage yards and was able to source a Duratec out of an '07 Fusion with about 90k miles for $300. We just finished the swap this weekend, but we now have to replace the crank pulley seal as it started weeping oil after we got it back together.
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Joel Rodriguez 12-30-2013 05:07
Hey guys. Just an update. Put about 1800 miles since the swap. All has been well up until few days ago. I get this intermittent problem where the power delivery gets weird. Its as if the car is sluggish or has no power (especially on hills) until after 2k rpms. Then it just kicks in. Best way to explain it is that of a hondas vtec kicking in therefore I figured maybe it had something to do with the vvt system. Problem comes and goes. Ive got no engine codes aside from o2 sensors (temporarily gutted my manifold cat). Thanks again for the help everyone. Also im in the market for an 04-05 mazda 3 2.3 oil pan if anyone has one.
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kevin wenzel 01-13-2014 21:31
I dont know I hope this thread is still active, I am stumped!!!
I have a 2006 mazda 6 2.3 the motor is shot, so I found a 2004 mazda 6 2.3 to put in it.
I looked at this thread and it says just switch the intake cam, timing cover and crank pulley,
thats fine and I have done that except I am looking at the timing cover from the 04 and on the inside of the cover it has 2 holes, one toward the top like where the engine mount is and one above the crank looking at the 04 engine it has those two holes and looks like it is an oil passage to feed the timing chain tensioner.
Now looking at the 06 timing cover which I have to swap onto the 04 engine it does not even cover these holes on the 04 block let alone accomidate a passage to feed the timing tensioner. so I thought well maybe I could use the 04 timing cover and remount the crank sensor by making an adaptor plate to reposition the sensor.. hmm cant do that cause there is no room on the timing cover..
Geeze I am stumped and do not want to just put the newer cover on the older engine and possibly have no oil pressure or oil going to the tensioner etc.
If anyone has the answer please respond, I would so appreciate it.
Thanks
Kevin
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Nojodas67 01-14-2014 00:37
Your assumption is correct. You can install a newer version engine (2006 or newer Mazda or Fusion 2.3L) into an older version Mazda6 car (2003-2005), but NOT the other way around due to the different oil passages.
In the early version engine, the timing cover supplies all the oil pressure to the chain tensioner as well as the VVT solenoid. In a newer engine, the oil is delivered internally through the block and directly to the head through the head gasket, not the timing cover. So, you can bolt an early version timing cover on a later version engine, but NO OIL will travel through the oil passage in that timing cover, the oil is delivered to the tensioner and head internally.
I'm afraid you have no choice but to sell that motor and source a 2006 or newer Mazda or Fusion motor.
Depending on where you're located, I have a 2009 Fusion motor with just 12k miles I am about to list for $1400 shipped.
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nojodas67 01-21-2014 02:24
The 2009 motor has been sold. I have a 2007 currently for sale.
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Steve Krause 01-25-2014 13:41
I'm Sorry if this has been answered but I just finished my swap to a fusion engine in my 2004 Mazda 6 now it idols really rough and I can't get it to raise in RPMs for about 3 minutes and the tach just around a lot when I let off the gas the intake cam was the same and I swapped the timing cover oil pan and crank sensor and I get a P0340 code once it warms up even a bit it runs great lots of power and idols fine so what might I be missing?

Also I am brand new to using a Forum so I am sorry if my question is missed placed but I do have a 2.3l and I am not sure what year the fusion motor is but I checked the intake cam and they were the same
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nojodas67 01-25-2014 16:43
Comparing a 2004 to a Fusion engine (2006 or newer), I HIGHLY doubt the intake cams are the same. The only way they could be the same is if your Mazda6 has been swapped for a newer engine already. Everything about the two camshafts look the same, the only difference is the number of cogs on the end of the camshaft; 2003-2005 Mazda's have 5 cogs, late 2005-2008 Mazda6 AND all Fusion 2.3's have 6 cogs. If the timing covers were in fact, different, then I can say with certainty that the camshafts were different too.
I also know for certain that the ISC (idle speed control motor) hardware AND software are different, from Mazda and Ford. Even though they may look exactly the same, you must use your old ISC. There are just four 8mm-head bolts that hold the ISC/Trottle body onto the intake manifold.

About your car's symptom: I could not quite understand your first post; when writing in a forum, please make sure to use correct punctuation, your entire post is 1 sentence and quite confusing.
Are you basically saying that when the engine is cold it runs rough, but when it warms up, it runs ok? If that's the case, you could have a bad temp sensor, camshaft sensor, MAF sensor. But P0340 has to do with the cam sensor; Again, I bet that the camshafts ARE different, so you have to check that first. Just remove the valve cover and inspect the number of cogs very carefully.

Please post an update with your findings.
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Steve Krause 01-26-2014 04:21
Sorry I work in a prison and I was at the end of a very long shift when I typed that. I will take the valve cover off and inspect the cogs again. The engine I bought was just a long block so I used everything off the old engine including the intake manifold and throttle body. Other than buying the overpriced special tools for finding top dead center, is there a certain sized bolt or something I can use?
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Gordan 01-26-2014 00:14
Hi i just finish swap on my 2005 mazda 6 i install fusion engine and now it will not start i get one spark and then nothing i switch everything adjust timing.does crank pully needs to be install so that hole is at 6 o'clock thanks
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Artem Vestsorov 01-26-2014 21:03
Gordan, I have to be thorough. When you say you switched everything, did you swap the intake cam, timing cover, crankshaft pulley and position sensor, and all of the ignition stuff? Not sure what you mean by "get one spark and then nothing" - I'm assuming the engine cranks over and over but you are not getting spark?

Yes, all of the timing adjustments are done with the hole in the pulley at 6 o'clock. When you were finished with setting the timing did you verify that it was correct by rotating the engine and then installing the camshaft tool and a bolt through the hole in the crank pulley?

Please give as much detail as possible.
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Daniel Torok 10-07-2016 19:26
I have the same problem!!!! I am trying to start the car for 5 years! Any help will be very appreciated Thanks in advance!
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Joe 01-26-2014 17:48
This post is great information, as my 2005 6i 2.3 just started knocking, and yesterday I found out that what I thought was valvetrain chatter was in fact something much worse. My mechanic thinks its a piston pin so therefore I need to either rebuild the existing or swap with a long block. I'm thinking Long block the easier of the two.
@nojodas67: how can I tell if I have the older 05 vs the newer? I know it has a single coil pack for all spark plugs but should I look for anything else? VIN digits etc...?

Cheaper is always better, so thank you for starting this particular post. I am very appreciative!
Joe
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nojodas67 01-26-2014 19:57
Hi Joe,
First off, you are welcome...it's nice to be appreciated. I'm sure Artem (who started this guide feels the same way).
About your car, before you either rebuild or swap your engine, first verify that you in fact have a spun bearing, it could be just a bad VVT gear, which will cause the infamous valve-train noise in these cars. To know for sure, run your engine with one spark plug wire disconnected, one at a time. If the noise goes away, then you have also identified which rod journal is damaged. If the noise DOES NOT go away, then your problem is most likely just an upper end noise like a bad VVT gear, or a leaking timing chain tensioner, which are replaceable without removing the engine NOR the cylinder head.

Anyway, if you do have to pull the engine, it does not really matter which version engine you have, you can use a Fusion motor for any year Mazda6; but if you have the later version Mazda there will be less work involved with the swap, as already explained in the guide. Easiest way to tell is pull your valve cover and count the cogs on the end of the intake camshaft (5=earlier version, 6=you're in luck).
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nojodas67 01-26-2014 19:58
(continued)

I've also re-conditioned 2 of these Mazda 2.3L motors and it's quite simple. If your engine has just started knocking, you can just grind your rod journals and install undersize rod bearings (.075 undersize), and new std main bearings for about a couple hundred bucks, you'll need to replace the bad conn. rod with a new or used rod, as they are not re-buildable; If you are careful during disassembly and do good prep work before putting it all back together, you can even re-use your head gasket, and head bolts (I've done it several times without fail); you should replace the chains and tensioner always, though.

If you plan on keeping the car for a while, then a low-mileage Fusion engine might be the way to go, but you'll spend about $600-$1000 on a low mileage engine, it's up to you.
Good luck.
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Joe 01-27-2014 18:31
As I figured my guy had already checked for the VVT issue. I have found a 06 milan 2.3, 67k, 12/12000 warranty. for $850 delivered, and their local.

Anything I need to replace on this motor since I have it out of the car, i.e timing belt, water pump etc...?

Assuming the Quote below covers what needs to be swapped between the two motors, I will need Timing cover gasket, Valve cover gasket, and intake and exhaust. Is there anything else I should have on hand to make the process go smoother?

Quoting Brian:
so everything had to be swapped (crank pulley, crank sensor, timing cover, oil pan, intake cam, valve cover, and all ignition stuff). Because the crank pulley and sensors are different the crank sensor mounts in different spots, which means you have to swap the front timing cover. I swapped the oil pans while doing the timing cover. I used permatex gray on both covers. I found and downloaded a factory manual , which helped with torque settings and setting timing. The studs for the alternator had to be removed from the fuzion motor. Torque converter bolts are loosened through the starter hole.
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nojodas67 01-27-2014 19:56
$850 is kind of high for a motor with so many miles, especially if you don't know how it was maintained, if any oil changes were skipped, etc. For that amount, you can have your crank reground, put all new bearings in it, new timing chains, valve job done on the head, all new rings, seals and gaskets. You'll basically have a new engine again.
Go to car-part.com and try to find a motor with lower miles, they're out there.

About what needs to be swapped, I already explained to you that it depends on what version engine you have; I'll say it again, that to know for sure you have to physically look at your intake camshaft cogs and crank sensor, why guess?

You mentioned timing belt, there is NO timing belt...these engines have 2 chains. A good idea is to replace the front crank oil seal and thermostat while the engine is out. Other than that, there is nothing else that you'll need to do extra, besides what was already outlined in the guide.

Gasket material: timing cover and oil pan just use permatex or similar product, no gasket needed, just make sure mating surfaces on both parts are thoroughly cleaned and free of oil or grease. Valve cover gasket (actually it's a rubber ring), intake (rubber rings) and exhaust gasket (reusable)...I' ve always just used the ones that came with the newer engines and never had a problem.
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Joe 01-27-2014 20:29
Sorry, belts, chains, I'm not the mechanic, my buddy is. Thanks again for your input and I will keep looking.
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Steve Krause 01-30-2014 19:21
OK so I pulled the valve cover off and counted 5 cogs on the intake cam I also checked timing again everything seems spot on. After about 30 seconds to 1 minute when the engine is cold it acts up back firing and not wanting to raise in RPMs. Also while driving if I let my foot off the gas but don't put the clutch in, the tach goes nuts dropping to 0 then back up but will idle perfectly. Any Ideas? I am still popping a P0340 code
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JOEL RODRIGUEZ 01-30-2014 19:39
Im not expert but I just did this swap into my 04 mazda3. As previously stated its highly unlikely that your intake cam is the same. Its not the number of teeth on the cog but also placement of the teeth. Just swap the cam and make sure timing is 100%. I spent over half a day scratching my head and it was my timing all along.
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Steve Krause 01-30-2014 20:56
I checked they are the exact same cams. I triple checked think for sure I was gonna have to swap them. What else could it be?
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Nojodas67 01-31-2014 03:02
Quoting Steve Krause:
I checked they are the exact same cams. I triple checked think for sure I was gonna have to swap them. What else could it be?

@Steve Krause: Two very important questions:
1) Did you purchase the correct timing tools?
2) Did you have to swap the timing covers? In other words, did you use your old timing cover on the Fusion engine in order for the crank sensor to mount properly, or did you keep the Fusion cover?
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Nojodas67 01-31-2014 03:03
@Steve Krause:
I have NEVER seen a Fusion engine with 5 cogs on the intake cam; I know all the cogs on the camshaft are hard to see while in the head so you may have missed it; I really think you should have swapped cams anyway if you are working on a 2004 Mazda. The only year that this becomes ambiguous, is 2005, as already explained several times in the guide. Did you compare the thickness of the timing chains on the two engines, they should be different. If they are the same, they did NOT sell you a Fusion engine. The Fusion engine has a thicker chain than the Mazda engine, and are NOT interchangeable .
One sure way to find out what engine you installed, check the engine VIN. The engine VIN is stamped on the edge of the bell housing near the firewall, right next to the exhaust manifold and it's very easy to see. Make a note of the first 3 characters. The first number is the year of the engine, then if it follows by a "5M", then it's a Mazda motor, if it's a "R1" then it's a Fusion motor, "R6" = Mercury Milan. Let me know what those first 3 characters are and we'll go from there.
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Steve Krause 01-31-2014 03:22
I had to use my timing cover. I also had the timing checked by a shop who specializes in imports and had the 2 special tools needed to check timing on the 2.3l.
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Steve Krause 01-31-2014 03:59
So I tried to find a Vin and I couldn't find it. Im pretty sure I know where it was but I'm guessing it's been ground off. Makes me wonder. The timing chain is way thicker on the new motor. I checked the cam again other than the thicker great is exactly the same.
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Nojodas67 01-31-2014 05:23
Page 3, step# 28, first picture: Look in the area at the rear of the cyl. head. There is an outlet for one of the heater hoses on the firewall side of the head; right below that hose outlet is where you'll see a flat spot on the bell housing about 1" wide x 6" long, that's where the VIN is stamped. It's also shown on Page 4, step#3, there are only 2 bell housing mounting bolt holes shown, follow the bolt holes vertically up and you'll run into the VIN.

If your tach is bouncing around, it sounds like a bad ground somewhere. Make sure that the ground wire at the pass. side motor mount is attached and making a good connection (remove it, clean it with sand paper and tighten back down), pictured on Page 3, step #26. There is another ground wire out of the wire loom at the rear of the engine, that is attached to a 10mm bolt on a thin-metal bracket that is bolted to the bell housing, behind the engine block, at the rear of the cyl. head, on top of the transmission. pictured on Pg.3, step #27. Just below the only small coolant hose still attached to the engine is the bolt I'm referring to, but the wire connector is no longer attached.
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Nojodas67 01-31-2014 05:35
The engine VIN is a legally necessary number that must be available to law enforcement officials, just like the vehicle VIN, transmission VIN, Unibody VIN, frame VIN, etc. A salvage yard cannot legally sell you an engine with the VIN grounded off, I surely hope you have a receipt for that engine in case the car is ever inspected by police, but then again, with no engine VIN visible, you can't really prove that the engine belongs to you. Similarly, when dealing with boats; in most states the engines on boats, whether outboard or inboard have to have their own certificate of title, a separate document to the certificate of title for the boat itself. Since the engine VIN in your car does not match the vehicle vin, and you have no proof of ownership, if your car ever gets inspected by law enforcement for whatever reason, it could be impounded. I don't mean to alarm you, but I've seen it happen to someone I know. He had to go through A LOT of red tape to get his car back.
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Steve Krause 01-31-2014 20:32
So problem solved one its a jdm motor and I have the reciept for it. The problem was the cogs are the right ones but they were out of adjustment. A little tap of the hammer using a punch and done. Car runs perfect no light or anything. I did have to reset the light but every issue is gone.
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JOEL RODRIGUEZ 01-31-2014 20:39
Huh? Japanese ford fusion motor? Ohh well at least you have the thing running.
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Steve Krause 01-31-2014 21:17
I know everything says it's a fusion motor bigger timing chain having to swap the timing cover. But it runs perfect now no issues at all. Thank you all for your help.
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Nojodas67 01-31-2014 22:28
We actually don't know if it's a Fusion motor, you still have not told us the VIN.
Cogs out of adjustment? That makes no sense, the cogs on the camshaft are cast aluminum and part of the cam itself, not a separate part, and if you try to bend them, they will break off.
Are you referring to the 35 teeth on the crank sensor wheel? That wheel is thin sheet metal and those teeth do bend easily.
Please clarify so we can put this one to bed.
Either way, glad you got it resolved.
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Steve Krause 01-31-2014 22:35
The cogs at the other end of the intake cam from the timing chain are pressed on and can be removed and pressed back on. The slot at each end of the cam used for timing the engine can also be used as a reference point for position of the cogs. I tapped the cogs using a brass punch and a hammer and lined it up. I used the old cam as a reference for the new cam. I turned it about an 8th to 16th of an inch and bam car runs perfect.
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Steve Krause 01-31-2014 22:36
If you look closely its not cast with the cam its a ring put on the cam later. The ring turned not the cam.
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nojodas67 02-01-2014 05:12
Wow...I thought the cog ring was permanently affixed to the cam, but that would just make too much sense.
Thanks for letting us know though, I never would have imagined it being done this way...Now I know that there's yet one more thing that can go out of alignment and fail on these POS engines. That is just AS BAD a design flaw, as having cam and crank gears without Woodruff keys. I have rebuilt many brands of engines in the last 30 years and when I first learned of this particular 2.3, I remember saying, loud enough that my wife heard me from inside the house, "What the #$%@ were the morons that designed this pos thinking?"
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Steve Krause 01-31-2014 22:37
There is no vin on jdm engines. I verified this fact.
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nojodas67 02-01-2014 05:16
Ok good, better safe than sorry later. Make sure you keep that receipt for as long as you own the car. And if you do sell it, pass it on to the new owner.
I'm sure someone out there will someday benefit from this very useful piece of information.
Thanks for following up. Case closed.
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Zane 02-10-2014 15:16
I am also installing an 06 jdm engine in an 03 mazda 6. The intake cam cog is physically the same, but like steve said it is clocked different. It causes the P0340,hesitatio n, and rpm to bounce all over the place.
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Zane 02-10-2014 16:31
I will also add that JDM engines have a 1/4" taller intake port. The stock intake gasket will NOT seal on the ports, you will need to make a custom gasket to make it work otherwise you will have a vacuum leak on all 4 cylinders.
I am an engine builder, and this is the first time I've seen this. Just sharing my information to hopefully save someone else the frustration.
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John Mollohan 02-10-2014 18:21
Puttin an '08 fusion engine in my '03 mazda 6. I know I have to switch valve covers but it looks like the dipstick on the fusion engine actually comes through the valve cover, but I cant really tell from the pics!! how will I handle this or is it just an optical illusion and it doesn't come through the cover!!
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Steve Krause 02-10-2014 18:23
Quoting John Mollohan:
Puttin an '08 fusion engine in my '03 mazda 6. I know I have to switch valve covers but it looks like the dipstick on the fusion engine actually comes through the valve cover, but I cant really tell from the pics!! how will I handle this or is it just an optical illusion and it doesn't come through the cover!!


Just swap the oil pan and use the old dipstick
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Artem Vestsorov 02-10-2014 19:00
Can someone explain why people with 05 and lower Mazda 6s are swapping valve covers and oil pans? Since I have an 06 all I can go on are photos but it looks to me like you should be able to keep using the Fusion valve cover and oil pan. Is something not mounting up on the Fusion valve cover? What am I missing here?
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Zane 02-10-2014 20:31
It doesnt matter where the dipstick is. Keep the fusion valvecover and pan.
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Kevin 02-10-2014 23:26
My mechanic just put a used 20o7 Merc Milan 2.3 (28K miles) into my 2006 Merc Milan.
Runs great but now throws a PO172 (too rich) code. MAF looks good, no vac leaks. The new engine is a low emissions California. Any chance I would need to reflash the PCM since my 2006 was not a low emission?
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Artem Vestsorov 02-11-2014 17:00
No you should not need a reflash. The biggest difference is that PZEV Fusions and Milans had a secondary air injection system and a different exhaust manifold. I'm sure they were also tuned differently. But the actual long block is the same between the two.

I would look for exhaust leaks and vacuum leaks. I know you said no vac leaks but I would check again. Does the code come back if it is cleared?
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Zane 02-11-2014 05:14
If he switched all your sensors/manifol ds from the old engine to the new it shouldn't matter.
A few questions,
What are your stft and ltft readings on a scan tool?
Did he change spark plugs?
is your engine reaching 195°f?
When was the last time you checked your air filter?
All of these things can cause a rich condition.
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Kevin 02-12-2014 03:14
Thanks. The code was cleared but I have only driven about 125 miles so far. Will give it a few more days. Plugs were not changed. Don't know the readings on the scan tool but mechanic said they were within limits (whatever that means). He did unplug vacuum and could see the reading change accordingly. He also checked for leaks on fuel rail and found none. Not sure about the temp being 195F but I am aware that OEM thermostats are crap. Had the joy of changing one out on the last engine....about 9hrs of my life I will never get back. Will check back in a few days and let you know if light stays out. Also, air filter is new.
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Kevin 02-15-2014 00:24
Hmmm. CEL back on, now showing P0171.
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Zane 02-15-2014 05:26
Check again for vacuum leaks. Did you have the pcv hose and valve under the intake replaced when the engine was done? Any symptoms besides cel? It wouldn't hurt to check fuel pressure either, it would at least rule out a weak fuel pump.
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Kevin 02-24-2014 14:12
Okay, turns out it was the MAF sensor. I had a a new one (not Ford) put in a few months ago and just replaced that one with the original. Also checked air filter (fine) and reseated the housing. Not sure if it has anything to do with the problem but I also reinstalled the fresh air scoop (shop had left if off due to a broken mount). Have gone over 700 miles now, no CEL. Thanks all for your help.
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Zane 02-12-2014 04:19
Basically is the coolant temp gauge getting to halfway? An engine running colder will run richer.
If the code cleared and hasn't come back yet I wouldn't be too concerned about it. Usually it will store a pending code in the computer on the first drive cycle it sees it running rich, but it will not turn on the cel. if it sees it on either 2 or 3 consecutive drive cycles it will turn the cel on. So if you've drove to work and back a couple times it should've come back on by now if there was an issues.
If your fuel trims are within +/- 10% your engine is running just fine.
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Zane 02-12-2014 04:24
I personally put new spark plugs, and a new thermostat in all used engines I install. They are very cheap insurance, and very easy to swap out with the engine on the floor.
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brandon 11-18-2014 04:12
Hello my 2004 6i 2.3 roof mounted antenna makes a loud knocking noise from the top of the motor.it all started with a little ticking sound and it would get louder as I revved it wouldn't be really noticeble till about 2-3000 rmps. I checked the oil and it was nearly dry I put 4 quarts of oil in it. Ichecked for poodles of oil but nothing. I took it to the mechanic and he told me that the motor is shot . it doesn't over heat. My question is ...is there anything I can do to determine if Its something I can fix myself or a mechanic without having to swap or buy a used Mazda engine
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Artem Vestsorov 11-18-2014 13:18
Your engine has developed a rod knock due to oil starvation - this is common issue. Only fix is to either rebuild or swap the engine.
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DB 02-12-2014 18:03
Hello. I am not a mechanic but I was hoping to get some expert advice on my mazda 6 which has had an engine swap done to it.A few months ago a bought a used 2008 mazda 6i automatic from someone on craigslist. What I didn't know at the time when I bought this was that it had what I now believe to be the 2.3 engine from a 2005 California version of the engine. This version of the engine unlike the other older first versions of the engine has coil on plug as opposed to the the coil pack.I later realized this wasn't the original 2008 engine when I saw that the dipstick was in the front of the engine as opposed to in the top like the second version which came with the 2008. As best as I can tell I have the 2008 ignition system(wiring harness, coil on plug) with a 2005 2.3 engine.
The car actually drives pretty well but after a while I noticed that there is pretty bad vibration when stopped in drive and even noticeable in neutral. It also seems a little bit loud and growly sounding when it accelerates. Its not the mounts, plugs, MAF ect.

I did have a mazda dealer tech have a quick look under the hood. He didn't even want to have me leave it with them.
He did say it could be lots of things since its the wrong engine but it likely the timing is off.

Can anyone tell me what is most likely causing the vibration?
The timing?...or maybe since I have the 2008 ignition system with a different model coil on plug than the 2005 ignition system?

Thanks in advance for any advice.
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nojodas67 02-13-2014 00:09
What is your engine serial number? Read my previous posts if you are unsure where to find the engine number.
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DB 02-13-2014 02:34
Replying to your comment here.

I think this is the engine VIN:
55m31416
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Max 07-18-2014 01:24
Hey "DB", what intake camshaft is in your 2005 California engine, does it have 5 teeth or 6 teeth cog? i have a 2005 Mazda 6 California model and i have a 2005 engine form non California model. i need to know if i have to change my intake cam and crankshaft pulley ... or not. also what design is your crankshaft pulley? how many empty spaces are on the trigger wheel? Thank you!
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nojodas67 02-13-2014 14:15
Ok, this is the complete vehicle vin from the donor car where the engine came from: 1YVFP80CX55M314 16; if you are interested in how many miles the engine that's currently in your car has, you can just run a carfax on this VIN and it will tell you the last odometer reading of that car.
As far as I can tell, your car has a genuine Mazda engine from a 2005 car with California emissions, according to local Mazda dealer. It really does not matter that you have a different year engine. As far as emissions version, the only difference is with the catalytic converter, California emissions cars have a pre-cat plus a main cat, unlike the federal emissions cars. The long block itself is the same, all O2 sensors are the same. The California PCM has different software to control the engine, but that will make no difference to that engine now in your car.
As far as the vibration, it could be uneven cylinder compressions, timing a little bit off, or a stretched timing chain. First, I would get a compression test and a cylinder balance test, if all compression readings are within 10%, then I would take the valve cover off, inspect the play on the chain and check it's alignment with the proper tools for that engine.
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DB 02-13-2014 16:43
Wow.Thank you for all of that info! That is really helpful. I can talk to my mechanic about the things to look at that you mentioned. I thought I already had a compression test but I need to ask him.

One thing I wanted to ask: I was looking at maybe replacing the OEM coils and I found that there are different model replacement coils for 2005 and 2008. Also the 2005 coils aren't compatible with 2008 wires since they have different connectors. Is there any chance that since the coils are a different model that maybe the 2008 coils I have are designed close enough to work with the 2005 engine but differently enough that there might be an issue with how well its sparking maybe causing the vibration?

Thanks
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nojodas67 02-13-2014 20:47
The 2008 coils on a 2005 engine should not make any difference. I did not suggest to replace the spark plugs or motor mounts (although they would've been my first items to check because you had already ruled them out in your first post. Most likely, the vibration is caused by low compression in one or two of the cylinders or unbalanced engine. If the compression check reveals that all cylinders have acceptable compression, then I would follow that up with a balance test. It consists of turning off one cylinder at a time and observing the % drop in power. If one or more cylinder has a low drop (in other words, it's not contributing power as much as the others) then I would look at the coil for those cylinders. At that time, you can then swap out coils and see if the low % drop follows the suspect coils.

It is also possible, though unlikely, that the balance shafts are out of timing. Again, very unlikely since the balance shafts are gear-driven directly by the crankshaft (not chain driven), unless the engine was disassembled then incorrectly re-assembled, prior to the swap.
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DB 06-09-2014 21:00
Hi again Nojodas. Many months ago you gave me recommendations (above in this chain of messages) for me about my 2008 6 that had a 2005 engine installed which runs rough with mild to medium vibrations at all rpms.

I looked into having someone take of the valve cover and check timing but they where saying it would be hundreds of dollars to even look. I did have a dealer mechanic have a quick look under the hood and he was certain that me having the older 2005 engine in the 2008 car would have unfix-able timing issues. I am not sure if he meant valve timing or otherwise. He said you cant swap to older model engines and have it work perfectly. Like I have said previously the vibration and slightly loud sound at any rpm is not extreme but it is certainly more than subtle.

I starting to think about getting rid of this engine and having someone do the ford engine swap. What I am wondering is that if I have a 2005 mazda engine would that be something I could sell/trade without having an actual provable engine mileage to show someone? I know that you gave me the VIN for this engine after I gave you the engine serial. That would only tell me the mileage before it was installed in my car and I have no idea at what point they put it in.

Please let me know your thoughts.

Thank you
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justduit2 11-28-2014 09:48
Maybe a bit late to help out DB, but perhaps someone else may benefit. The vibration and growl are characteristic of a Balance Shaft Delete mod. A sure way to tell is by the amount of oil required to bring the level to normal on the dipstick. Removing the balance shaft assembly requires an extra quart of oil since that is about how much it displaces in the sump.

Mark
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nojodas67 11-29-2014 17:00
DB,
Sorry I have not been to this site for a while as many of us were not being notified of new posts; that issue seems to be fixed now.
Did you ever do anything more about your issue? Also, what part of the country are you in?
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DB 02-13-2014 21:43
I really appreciate the great advice. I will talk to my mechanic about your recommendations . I will let you know how it goes later.

Thank you
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Chris 02-18-2014 05:49
I just completed an engine swap on an '04 Mazda 6, using a 2.3 from an '06 Fusion. Everything went well, thanks in large part to this website. Thanks for sharing the info.

I did find something that I haven't seen mentioned on here (or maybe missed it?). The spark plugs between the '04 and '06 engines are different. When comparing the heads, the spark plug wells on the '04 have a deeper bore and less thread length than the '06. The '04 spark plugs also have shorter threads. They'll screw in to the '06 block, but I assume the electrode will not reach as far into the combustion chamber as it should. I kept the factory '06 plugs in place for now, but am wondering if there is a difference in heat range between the '04 coil-pack and '06 coil-on-plug system.

This also causes a minor problem with the spark plug wires. Since the plugs are slightly higher (due to the shallower bore), the boots do not fully seat into the '04 valve cover. This may be resolved by using the plastic valve cover from the '06, but I'm not going to bother with changing it.

There was some mention on here that the Fusion engines have a beefier timing chain. My '06 chain and sprockets were exactly the same size as the '04 engine.
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nojodas67 02-20-2014 23:19
All Mazda6 engines came with the thinner chains, it's possible that your 04 Mazda already had the engine swapped or the chains/sprocket s replaced. One sure way to tell is to look at the engine VIN, as I've explained in previous posts.
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Colin Jumper 02-20-2014 21:37
Thanks for this excellent guide. I changed out an '06 Mazda3 2.3 with a thrown rod to an '06 Fusion 2.3 with 17,000 miles this last weekend. Got the long block for $675. Switched out all the external parts (oil pan, H2O pump, oil filter, tension pulley, alternator, crank pulley, and all sensors and even the valve cover) so that the Fusion motor now has all the Mazda parts on it. Only 2 issues in changing out parts: had to punch the hole in the middle of the valve cover for the temp sensor and only 3 bolts for the alternator.

When I checked the timing on the Fusion motor I noticed a couple of things. With the timing plug in place the #1 piston was not at true TDC but of by a couple of degrees. (checked this with a screwdriver sitting in the spark plug hole and looking at the crank journal.) When I removed the peg and turned crank to true TDC the timing hole in Crank pulley lined up beautiful. I put this down to a probably China made peg I ordered off Amazon. With the crank pulley timing hole aligned and the crank at true TDC the camshaft timing tool would not fit into the camshaft slots but rather they were both off by 1 or 2 degrees (the same amount for both shafts). If I took the crank just past TDC the tool fit perfectly. I know that if I tried to move them by 1 tooth it would be too much and since the motor was in such great condition and had been running I reasoned that this 1 or 2 degrees was OK.
(continued)
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Colin Jumper 02-20-2014 21:44
The motor fired and ran smooth and quiet immediately after the install. (sounds like this was pretty quick but actually had about 16 hours in the project.) I let the car idle about 10 minutes. Cleared a crank/cam position sensor code which was the only code showing. Then the motor started knocking pretty bad. I thought it was a bad motor (even though it only had 17,000 miles on it) so I put it back in the shop. Pulled the valve cover and oil pan again to try and diagnose the noise. Timing hadn't slipped and was still the same as described. Couldn't feel or see any play in the rods or pistons. Lifters all worked nicely. Rolled it over many times and checked for valves hitting pistons but nothing there. 2 hours later put it all back together and fired it up again. Ran smooth for about 10 min. Then it started to bog down on the idle a little and the knock started again. I let it run and listened to it.

(cont)
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Colin Jumper 02-20-2014 21:45
Started to sound to me like a loud pre-ignition knock rather than a mechanical knock. Shut the car of and then restarted. Same thing. Runs smooth until it starts to slow idle and then the knock comes. Unconnected the #1 injector wire (sounds like it is coming from #1 cylinder) and knock went away. Ran smooth then starts the knock. Tried the injector again and sometimes it goes away sometimes it just lessens considerably. Drove it and it has good power but the knock will develop if it lugs down or I accelerate hard. It has thrown the crank/cam sensor code again.

Any thoughts
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Steve Krause 02-20-2014 21:53
Quoting Colin Jumper:
Started to sound to me like a loud pre-ignition knock rather than a mechanical knock. Shut the car of and then restarted. Same thing. Runs smooth until it starts to slow idle and then the knock comes. Unconnected the #1 injector wire (sounds like it is coming from #1 cylinder) and knock went away. Ran smooth then starts the knock. Tried the injector again and sometimes it goes away sometimes it just lessens considerably. Drove it and it has good power but the knock will develop if it lugs down or I accelerate hard. It has thrown the crank/cam sensor code

Call me I think I can help ##########
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nojodas67 02-20-2014 23:40
It's common on these engines that when the VVT gear goes bad, it sounds like a rod knock. I had a knocking engine in a Mazda6 a while back, but I was not convinced that it had a thrown rod, so before I swapped the motor, I disabled the VVT gear. There is a write up about how to do it (on the car) in the Mazda6 club forum, but I'll have to search for it. If you think that may be your issue, let me know, and I'll look for the post.
About the cam sensor code, these engines will throw a code if the VVT gear has play in it. So next step would be to disable the VVT gear (at the end of the intake camshaft). Basically you remove the valve cover, remove the four torx bolts that cover the VVT, and insert a piece of plastic or wood to prevent any movement of the VVT actuator), put back together and run the engine and listen for the knock. VVT is a source of A LOT of the problems with these engines and should NEVER have been implemented. This same 2.3L engine is in the Escape, Focus, and Tribute vehicles, but these do not have the VVT gear at the end of the intake camshaft, and I have not heard of them knocking or blowing up prematurely, like in the Mazda vehicles with VVT.
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Colin Jumper 02-21-2014 17:15
Just spoke w/ Steve about aligning my cam timing cogs so going to check those out 1st. Does this Fusion engine I installed have the VVT gear in it?
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nojodas67 02-21-2014 20:42
Yes, the VVT gear is at the front end of the intake camshaft.
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Artem Vestsorov 02-20-2014 23:40
Couple of questions that I have after reading your story - 1. What temp sensor are you talking about that you had to punch a hole in the valve cover for? 2. Are you using a JDM engine?

Moving on.... it sounds like an obvious timing problem. During the swap did you check the timing cogs on the intake cams on both engines? They need to be have the same number of "teeth" and those "teeth" have to be in same position.

When you installed the Mazda crank pulley, how did you deal with the timing? The correct way to do it is to install the camshaft plate (with crankshaft at TDC using the peg) then slide in crankshaft pulley and keep it aligned using the M6 bolt. If the correct tools are used, everything WILL line up.

Finally you also have to make sure that the crankshaft position sensor is correctly lined up. I don't know if Mazda 3 procedure is the same as Mazda 6 but here it is - http://forum.mazda6club.com/mazdaspeed6/249653-crankshaft-position-sensor-i-really-need-some-information-guys.html

Let me know when you have Steve's number so I can edit out.
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Colin Jumper 02-21-2014 15:35
Double checked camshafts between both engines. They are identical. On the new motor, to get the cam shaft timing tool to insert I must turn the crankshaft past TDC a few degrees. I did not do this but rather aligned the crank pulley holes when the crank was @ TDC as this is the position it was before I pulled the Ford crank pulley. I did not install a new crank position sensor but reused the Mazda one. Centered it on the 5th tooth on the pulley ring as per the Haynes manual.
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John M 02-21-2014 05:33
Doin my swap finally on my 03 mazda installing 08 fusion. Couple questions. First, can I use the intake that's on the fusion-only noticeable difference is where a vac line hooks in on my mazda intake, the fusions had a rubber plug covering the nipple, easily removeable(will be using my throttle body from the mazda). I'm still n the garage and can't remember what else I needed to ask but that was def the most important question-thx
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Artem Vestsorov 02-21-2014 23:40
If you are sticking with your Mazda throttle body then you should be able to use the Fusion intake manifold. From what I can see, they are identical - with the exception of the vac line like you pointed out. MAP sensor is definitely the same. I can't say for sure that it will work because everyone usually uses their mazda manifolds but I would go for it.
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John Mollohan 02-23-2014 02:16
Ok just for the record, I used the fusion intake with mazda TB and it worked perfectly. One BIG issue, although the car will start up very easy, idles fine, and leaks no fluids, the oil pressure light is on. Obviously I didn't let it run more then a few seconds before shutting down but all fluid levels are correct. Im lost. When I swapped the cam the inside of this engine was so clean and obviously well maintained, I cant imagine it has anything to do internally but I just wanted to get the groups thoughts and hopefully some insight. Thx to everyone whos responded to my questions the last couple months. Once I get this light off I actually get to drive this thing, and I cant be more excited!!!!
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Steve Krause 02-23-2014 02:19
You have to swap the oil pressure sensor
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Colin Jumper 02-23-2014 03:01
Thanks to Steve Krause I have adjusted the cog on the intake cam so the Fusion engine matches the Mazda engine. Had to spin the cog about 1/8 inch. Went back through all timing steps and have found that the crank pulley has slipped a few degrees clockwise. I guess that's what comes from reusing the crank bolt and washer. Now I must realign the pulley. I purchased a new bolt and washer to solve the jumped timing issue. Trying to do this work at my son's house so don't have access to my compressor and impact wrench. Anyone have a great idea on how to hold the crank in position while I loosen the crank bolt with a breaker bar? Don't really want to drop the oilpan again to get at the flywheel.
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nojodas67 02-23-2014 22:50
You could remove the starter and hold it by the flywheel teeth.
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Colin Jumper 02-24-2014 23:36
Man am I thick! Never thought to access the flywheel that way. Spent Sunday building a pulley holder like the Ford/Mazda tool which took 3 hours to cut, weld and grind as opposed to about 30 min to pull and reinstall a starter. Hoping to get back down to my son's on Sat and put this project to bed. I will take my angle gauge with me and get a reading in the cam.
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nojodas67 02-25-2014 00:02
I don't think I would do it that way; the pulley holder will hold the pulley, but the crankshaft still has the potential to turn enough to give you grief later. And I would definitely not rely solely on the crank TDC alignment tool (small bolt inserted in the side of the block) to hold the crank in place. I'm sure with the amount of torque required to turn the crank bolt an additional 90 degrees after the initial 90 ft.lbs, the small alignment bolt will either strip or take a chunk of the flimsy aluminum block with it, then you'll have a nice big hole on the side. I always use a pry bar, or something beefy against the flywheel teeth, or in one of the torque converter bolt holes (if my son is not around to hold the prybar) to keep the crank from turning. The more I think about these engines, the more I hate them.
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nojodas67 02-23-2014 17:59
Artem,
I guess it would be a good addition to this guide if pictures of the intake camshaft cogs were included. The timing cogs out of alignment seems to be a common issue with these engines, especially since the reluctor wheel (or camshaft sensor cogs) is able to be rotated. If there are any markings on the camshaft itself as reference, a couple pictures or an explanation may prevent any future problems with this swap.

Steve,
since you seem to be the one that first experienced this problem and found the solution, perhaps you could snap a few pictures and/or explain in detail how to adjust it properly.
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Steve Krause 02-23-2014 18:04
I have pictures. From what I can tell the only way to align the cogs properly is looking at the old cam shaft and adjusting the cogs using the timing slot in end of the intake cam. Or atleast thats how I did it.
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Zane 02-23-2014 18:19
I had to physically hold the old cam next to the new cam to see the difference.
if you are looking at the baxk of the cam from the drivers side, I had to drift the cog counterclockwis e about 1/8"
Colin, can you look for the casting number on your block? On the drivers side of the exhaust manifold, on the engine where the engine and trans bolt together there is a flat with some number and letters on it.
I am beginning to think the issue with the timing cog being clocked wrong may be specific to Japan built engines.
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nojodas67 02-23-2014 22:05
Pictures are fine, but there has to be a more definitive and accurate way of adjusting the reluctor wheel. If someone just wants to make sure and eliminate the possibility of the cogs being out of alignment, there has to be a way to measure this. If someone has an angle gauge, that could be a way to list where one cog has to be in relation to the flat horizontal slot on the end of the cam, when at TDC. As many of you know, even just a slight 1/16" can make these POS engines run like crap, throw all kinds of codes, and an unsuspecting mechanic would never think of checking the alignment of these cogs; even if he does, there has to be a way to measure this more accurately.
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Zane 02-27-2014 12:23
In the guide I would also include that jdm heads have 1/4" taller intake ports that stock intake gaskets will NOT seal on. It will leave like a .010" air gap at the top of all 4 cylinders which means a huge vacuum leak! You need to make a gasket out of rigid gasket material that fits the jdm engine, but has enough overlap that the stock orings will seal up against this new gasket.
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Artem Vestsorov 02-27-2014 17:22
I just remembered an earlier comment made by Mark asking about the intake manifolds not lining up. I didn't think much of it at the time but maybe he was also using a JDM engine. I'll update the guide.
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Steve Krause 02-27-2014 17:26
I have a picture and am extra gasket that makes it possible to use the jdm head and stock intake if you guys are interested
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Artem Vestsorov 03-01-2014 07:14
Steve, can you email me the picture of the gasket that you made? I'm curious to see what it looks like. Thanks.
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Andrew Elliott 04-26-2016 00:48
Hey Steve! I am currently doing this swap and have this issue with the stock intake not lining up. If you have a picture or a more detailed solution it would be a huge help!
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joseph s 03-01-2014 04:46
hi i have a 04 mazda 6 2.3l rod knocking. i bought a 07 mazda 6 2.3l i noticed timing is different i plan on switching everything over. where can i get these tools for timing at local parts store .. autozone? orileys? i herd allignment tool is 70$ can i make my own from home depot. and the 07 is in the car will it make it harder to replace and time is there any easy way to do it with the engine in the car also i bought whole swap motor and tranny. everything will still work correct? just not six speed? it just didnt make sense to me to put a new motor with 45000 miles onto a tranny with 190000. on the old motor knock isnt bad but its there do you think if i replace bearings it will work good? plan on selling old motor but it will be missing parts... so not worried about it. just want to make sure the 07 motor and tranny will work for my 04 mazda 6. i am going to swa all the original parts. did my research! need help finding the timing tools. is there a specific way to remove the tensioner the right way. and removing and installing the intake cam any special way to do this help will be greatly appriciated. i want my car back on the road asap. tooo much time and money my buddy is doing the swap and internal work for 1000$ is that a fair price?
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Artem Vestsorov 03-01-2014 07:12
I doubt that you can buy the tool set locally. Online it costs around $35 from massivespeedsys tem.com or you can also find it on eBay. I'm sure you can make it yourself but I don't have any details on that.

Do you know for sure that it is a rod knock? I can't say if you replace the bearings that it will work good. I've known people that slapped in new bearing and then put over 20,000 miles on the engine and there people that replace bearing only to have the knocking come back after a few hundred miles. It all depends on how much damage there is internally.

I'm assuming that you have an automatic transmission. In 2004 the Mazda 6 2.3 came with a four speed auto and in 2007 it was a five speed. So no, it won't work. I mean, it will physically fit but the 04 TCM won't work with the 07 transmission. You will have to swap TCMs but even then I have no idea if it will work.

I recommend you download the workshop manual, it will explain how to remove everything the correct way. Do a google search for "Mazda 6 workshop manual".
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Yui 03-02-2014 13:29
Is the pick up just a crank angle sensor? i was curious to know if i had to adjust the ignition timing after the swap over of parts? I have never done this for a Mazda before and wanted to know how to check or adjust the timing.
p.s Great detailed article about the differences between the engines model years. This article article really gave me the confidence to tackle the job at hand.
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nojodas67 03-02-2014 16:29
Everything you need to know about doing this swap (including your above questions), has already been outlined and discussed in this guide, just read it thoroughly.
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Brent Hoffman 03-02-2014 17:22
Hello, Just wanted to thank you for all of the helpful information. I just swapped the fusion engine into my wifes Mazda5. Basically the same as you described with a few more components to swap. I have put 75 miles on the car with out any problems.
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nojodas67 03-02-2014 18:03
Another good outcome for an otherwise lousy design (Mazda).
I think you are the first Fusion swap into a Mazda5. Please elaborate so that other Mazda5 owners will be able to benefit from your experience. How did you deviate from what's in the guide? Is there anything else you can add?
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TomS 03-02-2014 21:49
Thanks to this great site and great folks, I just finished the 09 2.3 Fusion to 04 2.3 Mazda 6. All swapped over fine following the information on this site. Grandson drove it to work just a few minutes ago. It had about 10 mile on it when I sent him on his way. No check engine lights yet. Hopefully none will appear. Flushed the cooling system and will change the oil in about 100 mile. Including gaskets, rear and front main seals, and all liquids it cost a total of pproximately $1100.00. As part of the cost, we bought the 09 with 60k mile for $750. Cheapest locally we could find.
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Brent Hoffman 03-03-2014 01:30
To swap the fusion engine into the Mazda5 I reused the following things from Mazda both cams, valve cover, oil pan, dipstick, crankshaft pulley, oil filter housing , timing cover, thermostat housing , thermostat, fuel rail and injectors, intake and exhaust manifolds, flywheel, and wiring. I removed the engine out of bottom of car letting engine and trans together on the cradle. I would highly recommend this way. Very simple and quick way to remove engine. I used an 06 fusion engine from local yard. I paid $700 for engine with 61k miles.
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Sebastian 03-11-2014 22:40
Hello I am just wondering if the VVT solenoid and VVT gears are the same in a 2003 Mazda 6 and 2006 Fusion both 2.3. The VVT in the 06 fusion motor has way less miles and looks in much better condition and would like to use it if able. Any input on this?
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Nojodas67 03-11-2014 23:21
Quoting Sebastian:
Hello I am just wondering if the VVT solenoid and VVT gears are the same in a 2003 Mazda 6 and 2006 Fusion both 2.3. The VVT in the 06 fusion motor has way less miles and looks in much better condition and would like to use it if able. Any input on this?

Sebastian,
In order to help you, first I need to know exactly what you're trying to do.
Are you installing a 2006 Fusion motor into your 2003 Mazda6? If so, No...the VVT gears are NOT the same, you Must use the Fusion timing chain and ALL gears; leave the Fusion chains and all gears on the Fusion motor. But you must use your Mazda intake camshaft and timing cover; When swapping the intake cam, swap just the cam, not the VVT gear. Put the Fusion VVT gear on your Mazda intake cam and put them both on the Fusion motor.
I hope this helps.
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Sebastian 03-11-2014 23:34
Sorry I should have been more specific. My 03 Mazda 6 2.3 motor died on me. Since it was at roughly 200k miles I figured I would do the fusion motor swap. I purchased a 06 ford fusion motor with 50k and trying to go through the process of swapping all items from my mazda motor to my fusion motor so I can install the fusion motor on my 03 mazda. But having heard all the stories on the VVT problems on these motors, I was wondering if I could swap the VVT gear and solenoid from the newer fusion motor and install back with the mazda intake cam.
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Nojodas67 03-12-2014 01:36
Quoting Sebastian:
Sorry I should have been more specific. My 03 Mazda 6 2.3 motor died on me. Since it was at roughly 200k miles I figured I would do the fusion motor swap. I purchased a 06 ford fusion motor with 50k and trying to go through the process of swapping all items from my mazda motor to my fusion motor so I can install the fusion motor on my 03 mazda. But having heard all the stories on the VVT problems on these motors, I was wondering if I could swap the VVT gear and solenoid from the newer fusion motor and install back with the mazda intake cam.

Sebastian, it sounds like you need to read the guide again from the beginning and carefully follow it, step by step.

As in my last post to you, I will repeat what I said to answer your specific question: "the VVT gears are NOT the same, you Must use the Fusion timing chain and ALL Fusion gears; leave the Fusion chains and all gears on the Fusion motor. But you must use your Mazda intake camshaft and timing cover; When swapping the intake cam, swap just the cam, not the VVT gear. Put the Fusion VVT gear on your Mazda intake cam and put them both on the Fusion motor. "
Good luck.
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Sebastian 03-12-2014 02:57
Ok thanks for that. So I didnt see a section or a comment on wether you have to install the timing gear in a certain way. Does it matter which way the gear is positioned? I know how the alignment has to be on the timing cogs, just not surr on thr gear.Also if this has been asnwered throughout the cycle of the comments, im just in the middle of swapping all the parts and didnt havr time to read every single comment.
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Nojodas67 03-12-2014 03:59
Quoting Sebastian:
Ok thanks for that. So I didnt see a section or a comment on wether you have to install the timing gear in a certain way. Does it matter which way the gear is positioned? I know how the alignment has to be on the timing cogs, just not surr on thr gear.Also if this has been asnwered throughout the cycle of the comments, im just in the middle of swapping all the parts and didnt havr time to read every single comment.

The VVT assembly gear can go on in any direction, just line up the notch in the gear, see second video. It is EXTREMELY important to follow proper timing procedure of these engines, if any of the gears slip because of improper torque on any of the bolts, you WILL destroy your new Fusion engine.
Here's a short video that should give you an idea on what to do, but do follow the steps and proper torque procedures in this guide. The videos are just to give you an idea, the guide is your bible.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IL5P7wEIymM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBJ31S2WuaI
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Nojodas67 03-12-2014 04:06
One more:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqwnDmDkZrQ
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Arek F. 07-07-2015 19:28
Quoting Nojodas67:
Quoting Sebastian:
Ok thanks for that. So I didnt see a section or a comment on wether you have to install the timing gear in a certain way. Does it matter which way the gear is positioned? I know how the alignment has to be on the timing cogs, just not surr on thr gear.Also if this has been asnwered throughout the cycle of the comments, im just in the middle of swapping all the parts and didnt havr time to read every single comment.

The VVT assembly gear can go on in any direction, just line up the notch in the gear, see second video. It is EXTREMELY important to follow proper timing procedure of these engines, if any of the gears slip because of improper torque on any of the bolts, you WILL destroy your new Fusion engine.
Here's a short video that should give you an idea on what to do, but do follow the steps and proper torque procedures in this guide. The videos are just to give you an idea, the guide is your bible.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IL5P7wEIymM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBJ31S2WuaI


Are you 100% sure? In all mazda manuals I read they ask to mark the old VVT and install the new VVT in the exactly the same location. I'm not sure how accurate that is fusion VVT is installed differently than the one in my 3.
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Nojodas67 03-11-2014 23:23
The solenoids are the same, but I would use the lower mileage unit of course (Fusion).
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Sebastian 03-16-2014 02:35
So good news and bad news. Thanks a lot for the write up! Finally finished up car cranked and ran perfectly. But now the bad is that my car is stuck in Park and will not shift. I checked and rechecked all connections and every transmission item I removed and all were good. Brake lights light up and everything I'm just stuck and don't know what else to check. Any input!?
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nojodas67 03-16-2014 03:11
Quoting Sebastian:
So good news and bad news. Thanks a lot for the write up! Finally finished up car cranked and ran perfectly. But now the bad is that my car is stuck in Park and will not shift. I checked and rechecked all connections and every transmission item I removed and all were good. Brake lights light up and everything I'm just stuck and don't know what else to check. Any input!?

If you had done the swap the way I suggested in my early comments, you did not have to remove the transmission or remove any transmission connections or linkages.
Anyway, there is an electric solenoid that releases the park/lock mechanism. The brake pedal must be depressed fully and the key has to be in the "on" position. Make sure that all electrical connections to the transmission are fully engaged. I don't have a Mazda6 anymore, I just sold the last Mazda car I had, but I believe there is an override release if you remove a small plastic cap next to the shifter and insert anything small like a screwdriver or a key and press down to release the shifter out of park.
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Sebastian 03-16-2014 16:05
Well I dont see how I didnt have to remove my tranny since the 06 fusion motor I bought to install did NOT come with a transmission included. Either way I am familiar with the lock override that most older cars have. Unfortunately my 03 mazda 6 doesnt have a little cover that hides that override. Could it be in a different place besided on top next to the shifter
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nojodas67 03-16-2014 19:25
Quoting Sebastian:
Well I dont see how I didnt have to remove my tranny since the 06 fusion motor I bought to install did NOT come with a transmission included. Either way I am familiar with the lock override that most older cars have. Unfortunately my 03 mazda 6 doesnt have a little cover that hides that override. Could it be in a different place besided on top next to the shifter

I've swapped over a dozen engines in various year mazda6, ALL without removing the transmission, it's much easier. Look above for my comment about doing it this way: Nojodas67 10-31-2013 15:03, I guess you missed it.

Anyway, there is a shift release cable directly connected to the brake pedal, or an electric shift release solenoid, depending on model year. You can easily access the shifter release, by removing the shift knob (unscrew it counter-clockwi se), then removing the cup holder section, and shifter cover panel. It's all detailed in this thread:
http://forum.mazda6club.com/engine-drivetrain/213058-stuck-park-3.html
You could just disable the shift lock so you can drive the car until you get it sorted out.

Good luck. Let us know how it turns out.
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nojodas67 03-16-2014 21:49
This is the easiest and fastest way (under 2hrs) to remove the engine from a Mazda6, notice the transmission, both axles, transmission lines and all linkages are still in the car. No need to touch the suspension or axles at all!
http://i1336.photobucket.com/albums/o656/nojodas67/M1340003_zpsc0462ab0.jpg

With the front bumper, and core support removed; you have complete access to the engine; it's much easier for reassembly too. Also notice the engine comes out (and goes in) will all accessories (like alternator, power steering pump, a/c compressor, etc) and pulleys and serpentine belt ALL installed.
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joseph s 03-16-2014 15:15
i swappped everything over from the 04 motor to the 07 motor the only problem im having is there is no spark at all being disrtibuted when i crank the motor.

I think I might have damaged the crank shaft positioning sensor. I tried to use it against the 07 crank pulley. Because my car was giving spark before. Could it be something with the computer? Also there is a 2prong female plug by the ac line radiator have no clue where it goes all other plugs are in.
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nojodas67 03-16-2014 15:35
Quoting joseph s:
I think I might have damaged the crank shaft positioning sensor. I tried to use it against the 07 crank pulley. Because my car was giving spark before. Could it be something with the computer? Also there is a 2prong female plug by the ac line radiator have no clue where it goes all other plugs are in.

Joseph, do you have coil-over-plug ignition (4 coils...one on top of each spark plug) or single coil with spark plug wires? If you have 4 individual coils, make sure that the coil ground connector is secure. It goes on the backside of the cyl. head on top of the transmission. Look for the picture in the guide right under step 9: "9. A few more things to remove here. " In that picture, the ground wire for the coils is held on with an 10-mm bolt that is shown roughly in between the red small letters "b" & "c". Without that ground the coils will not give spark.
As far as the leftover female plug in the front, it could be the knock sensor connector, it is on the intake side of the engine (left side) in between the power steering pump and intake manifold.
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joseph s 03-16-2014 15:21
Also could it be wIth the transmission as well. Being the computer reading different. Being 04 5spped 07 6speed. I know I won't have the six gear sensor but we'll the transmission 07 work. When the tranny comes the motor cranks I can put it in to the gears. I need to figure out why I'm not getting spark. I know the motor will run I put the 04 into the 07 it should be ready to go. I'm stuck at why am I not getting any spark from my distributor I'm using the 04 the plug is in
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joseph s 03-16-2014 16:33
it is the 4 wires to 1. i dont know where that ground wire goes? is i remember that there was two grounds i saw on the right size i know one went to the tranny but the other on i didnt know where it goes so i put it on the transmission ground two grounds to 1 i figured it doesnt go there but i dont know exactly where it goes? how can i find that out?
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nojodas67 03-16-2014 18:47
"it is the 4 wires to 1" what does that mean? Do you have 4 coils on plugs, or 1 main coil and 4 plug wires coming out of it?

"i dont know where that ground wire goes?" Please read my previous explanation, it tells you exactly where the coil ground terminal goes. You should also verify that you have a good ground going into the coil(s).
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joseph s 03-16-2014 16:44
i cannot find pictures of the ground wires a link to the pic would be nice.. having trouble searching it up. One main coil the sparkplug wires look all pluged for the ground wire i am lost because i do not remember at you nd cant find what to connect and where a pic would be nice???

i read step nine not seeing anything that deals with the coil. or its ground. nots not any plugs. i know there is 3 ground plugs. 2 of them im sure where they go but the last one idk? but it is grounded its by the transmission there is a small one and a bigger on on the right side where tranny is the small one i know it goes there but the big one idk? would i be best to just have mazda figure it out why it not firing but i got the swap complete i just need fire to the coil and i should be up and running?
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nojodas67 03-16-2014 19:58
You really need to read my responses more CAREFULLY. I did not ask you to read step 9, I said that the picture you need is under step 9. The ground wire for the coil is denoted by the green arrow here: http://i1336.photobucket.com/albums/o656/nojodas67/mazda_6_shift_cable_removal_zpsbf768109.jpg

Again, you need to verify that the coil is getting a solid 12V battery current and a solid ground. There is also a way to verify that the crank sensor is good. It's all in the Mazda6 workshop manual that you can get online for free.
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joseph s 03-16-2014 20:09
i have the workshop manual it isnt in the book.... im looking at the pic..i cant identify the exact location
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joseph s 03-16-2014 20:12
ok now i see it. thanks! so if that wire isnt in that location it will not work correct. that ground has to go there? if so i hope that will solve my mystery.
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joseph s 03-16-2014 20:28
also it looks like it would be in a different position that doesnt look like the 04 mazda 6 tranny nor the 07?
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Artem Vestsorov 03-16-2014 21:40
Just got back from a weekend trip so I'm still catching up. Here are my observations after looking at your posts:

1. You said earlier that you are using the 07 crank pulley. That will not work. You need use the 04 crank sensor and 04 crank pulley.

2. The transmission has nothing to do with giving you spark. If there is a problem with the transmission range switch then the starter will not turn the engine, period. The engine is turning over so you can move on.

3. In regards to the grounds - it really doesn't matter where they go. All they have to do is touch another piece of metal (like the transmission or the engine). The photo in the guide is a manual transmission while you have an auto so the ground locations may be different.
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nojodas67 03-16-2014 21:57
Quoting Artem Vestsorov:
Just got back from a weekend trip so I'm still catching up. Here are my observations after looking at your posts:


3. In regards to the grounds - it really doesn't matter where they go. All they have to do is touch another piece of metal (like the transmission or the engine). The photo in the guide is a manual transmission while you have an auto so the ground locations may be different.

We must have been typing at the same time, our answers were posted within 1 second of each other. The point I was trying to make is for Joseph to make sure that the coil ground wire was connected to something solid and not just dangling out of the wire loom. That's why I was trying to pinpoint it's location to him, not to have him connect it at the exact location, but so that he knew the area about where it comes out of the wiring harness.
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nojodas67 03-16-2014 21:41
The transmission in that picture is a manual but the location of the ground wire is the same on both manual and automatic transmissions. The ground wire is NOT directly bolted to the transmission, it's bolted on a small metal bracket that is mounted on the transmission bell housing (both manual and automatic).
It doesn't really matter where the ground wires are mounted, just as long as it's a solid connection to ground. You need to verify that you have a good ground at the coil.
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nojodas67 03-16-2014 22:07
Oh crap, I just read this:
joseph s 03-16-2014 15:15
I think I might have damaged the crank shaft positioning sensor. I tried to use it against the 07 crank pulley. Because my car was giving spark before. Could it be something with the computer? Also there is a 2prong female plug by the ac line radiator have no clue where it goes all other plugs are in.
- See more at: http://www.happywrenching.com/mazda/6/mazda-6-and-ford-fusion-23l-engine-swap.html#sthash.hiF7p8tH.dpuf

Joseph, I read your above post to mean that you tried to use the 07 Crank pulley but it did not fit. I hope that you had the sense to use your 04 crank pulley, LIKE IT STATES IN THE GUIDE. If you have the 07 crank pulley installed, THE ENGINE WILL NOT START.

DUDE. You really really really need to read instructions CAREFULLY and follow them EXACTLY. I also remember Artem as well as myself telling you NOT TO USE the 07 transmission.
I'm pretty much done trying to help this guy now, I feel like I've just been going in circles.
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joseph s 03-16-2014 22:29
i have everything switched over now. im saying before i did any switching i tried to see if it would start that why i think that may be damaged because of me attempting to crank it when it not being set right 04 sensor on the 07 timing cover. everything is done and swapped over everything! im not getting spark at all. the coil is connected to the wiring harness and everything is ground? i did have spark before swapping engine? trying to find out what is the culprit the crankshaft sensor not reading and not allowing delivery of spark? because i found that if it not reading no spark will be distributed? trying to figure it out! i put allot of money in swapping the motor and swapping the parts. everything is exactly how the guide states now im not getting spark and im trying to figure out what is the cause of no spark there is no loose connections just one plug i dont know where it goes...? what is the best thing to do to get to the bottom of no spark? can any random mechanic figure it out or should i take to mazda? want to get it fixed the cheapest way preferably if i can figure it out but i am lost
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TomS 03-17-2014 04:42
Joseph,

I am more into electronics than mechanics. I have been in electronics for 50 years. I doubt that you damaged the sensor when you used it with the 07 timing cover, that is, unless it was banged around and cracked it. The sensor appears to me to be no more than a magnetic pickup which is "pulsed" by the teeth on the crankshaft pulley. It sends the "pulse" to the electronics in the coil/distributo r to get your spark. You do need the 12 volts to your Distributor/coi l and a good ground. This is not a rocket scientist device.

Question is: Are you sure you didn't get the 05 and 07 sensors mixed up and therefore the wiring doesn't match? I would take a look at the socket on the sensor and the plug on the wire to see if they have the same about of connectors.

Before giving up, I would find where the extra wire goes. It could also solve your problem, but of course I don't know that. I did as the instructions provided by this site and it was great.
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Artem Vestsorov 03-17-2014 12:27
IF everything was installed correctly the next step is to make sure that the crank sensor is sending a good signal to the ECU. You also need to check the coil connector and make sure that there is actually battery voltage going to the coil. I would also check to see if the ECU set off any trouble codes. All of this can be done with a multimeter and a scanner. Any competent mechanic should be able to test these components if you are not able to do so yourself. Note that I said "competent". A Mazda dealer should definitely figure it out - keep in mind though that if you tell them about the Fusion swap they probably won't want to touch your car.
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Joel Rodriguez 03-16-2014 23:45
Hey guys. Ive got about 5k miles on my swap and still going strong. Got a question. Went to swap spark plugs. Ordered a set of 04 mazda 2.3 plugs but they are shorter than the stock ford plugs im taking out of the 2009 fusion engine. Have to get them for a fusion. My question is why would the plugs be different size if engine dimensions are the same?
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Artem Vestsorov 03-17-2014 12:50
Engine dimensions are the same but ignition coils are different (one is the round style while the later 06+ engines use the square style) so this could be why they used longer reach plugs. The 06+ Mazda and Fusion also use a higher heat range spark plug. Why did they switch plugs? Only the manufacturer can say for sure but I'm guessing it is to help with idling, emissions, and power delivery.
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Joel Rodriguez 03-17-2014 12:56
Thanks for the quick reply bro. Yea the coils are a bit different. I was not able to get the fusion coils on there due to the harness being slightly different... but I do get a slight hesitation sometimes when giving it throttle. Going to rig up the fusion harness coil plugs to fit my mazda so that I can put the fusion coils and spark plugs.
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Artem Vestsorov 03-17-2014 12:59
Why not use the Mazda spark plugs and see how they run? You may find that it runs better with the short reach spark plugs.
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Joel Rodriguez 03-17-2014 13:02
Well the mazda coils I think one is going bad. When I did the swap I left a small to do list. One of which was to swap in the fusion coils. The mazda coils dont bolt in to the valve cover so they are just there vibrating around. Could I use ford coils with mazda plugs?
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nojodas67 03-17-2014 13:36
Quoting Joel Rodriguez:
Well the mazda coils I think one is going bad. When I did the swap I left a small to do list. One of which was to swap in the fusion coils. The mazda coils dont bolt in to the valve cover so they are just there vibrating around. Could I use ford coils with mazda plugs?

In a few of these cars I fixed, I remember the Fusion engines from the salvage yard came with the coil connectors attached (with a section of the wire harness) so I just spliced the wires and used the Fusion coils and Fusion spark plugs. You can try to find 4 coil connectors at your local junk yard; I believe Fusion, Milan, Focus, Escape, Taurus, etc all use the same connectors.
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joseph s 03-17-2014 13:29
i think it might be the cam shaft positioning sensor.? because the 04 and 07 look different and i e the 04 installed and im not getting spark. when i had the 07 pulley to the 04 crank sensor i only got one pop. now with the 04 crank an 04 sensor i get nothing i am thinking if i put the 07 cam sensor back hopefully it will fire, the 07 oil sensor is exactly the same as the 04 same with the vvt aculator. so im hoping its the cam sensors because it didnt feel right on the 07 valve cover. everything is in timing and 04 cam is in the 07 i also swapped out the exhaust cam too! it should fire and run now. but im stuck not receivin any fire. i think it might be the cam sensor. im hoping that if i put it back it will read! the 04 crank sensor have different mounting points on 07 timing cover so i had to put the 04 timing cover so it will mount. its got to be something so simple its stupid!!!!
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joseph s 03-17-2014 13:34
im not going to tell mazda anything. i didnt do the fusion swap i did a 07 mazda 6 engine/tranny swap in a 2004 mazda 6. i should be ready to run because followed this guide and did major work to my car. all im missing is spark and i dont know why. the battery was disconnected for all of this too. so shouldnt the computer be reset? i have no idea where the computer is? isnt it under the dash board?
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Joel Rodriguez 03-17-2014 13:40
The engine came with coils and harness... ive been procrastinating . Today is the day!! Lol
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joseph s 03-17-2014 13:47
ok so i used the 07 oil pressure sensor it says there different for ford fusion but what about mazda to mazda does it still have a difference? will that effect spark? and the camshaft temp sensor is the one that dont feel right. from the 07 to 04 it states that the top covers one is metal and plastic both of my covers look exacty alike and are both plastic. but have different look from the 07 to 04 and a different fit into the 07 motor. i thought the sensor on top is the cam sensor because its sits right above the timing cog? could this be the culprit because the 04 cam sensor doesnt sit flush on the 07 cover.? im hoping that this is the problem
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joseph s 03-17-2014 15:49
i talked to a couple mechanics and they said to check the pulsation? i have no idea? everything with the motor should be correct. there is only one plug that is a two prong female that i have no idea where it goes? i dont know what are all the causes that will stop it from getting spark a list of what to check would be nice im lost??!!!!
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Artem Vestsorov 03-17-2014 22:14
07 Mazda oil pressure sensor will work with the 04 engine. The part number is the same for 2003-2008. It does not affect spark.

As for the plug, well that could be anything. Without a picture I don't think anybody can tell you where it goes.

Here is a list of things to check - straight from Mazda - http://www.scribd.com/doc/212967240/2004-Mazda-6-No-Start

I don't have any more advice. My suggestion is to take it to a mechanic or better yet, a Mazda dealer because without a multimeter or a scanner you can't properly diagnose this.
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joseph s 03-18-2014 01:18
Ok so I got some good news doing this conversion to a 2007 Mazda 6 motor and tranny work in a 2004 Mazda 6!!!! i'm so happy i figured out that the ground wasn't connected to its plug! fired right up!!! wow. I just found out the temp gauge doesn't work so that plug must be one of them. i have two plugs i took pic of them one is a female plug and it has a yellow inside towards the back?. the second one has a blue clip on it toward the front. if i can figure out how to post the pics i can. and my traction control is on. and engine light is still on. it has the brand new cams any way to specially break them in? also the car would turn on when coming to a stop or letting go of the gas completely. it doesn't seem to do it often no that i put 25 miles on it so far! any advice on where the thermostat plug goes i'm thinking it might be the plug with the yellow inside one but not sure. also i herd a noise coming from the rotor before i took off to finally drive it i think it has something to do with traction control..
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Nojodas67 03-18-2014 03:05
"i'm so happy i figured out that the ground wasn't connected to its plug!"

Which ground?
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joseph s 03-18-2014 01:29
i sent the pics let me know thanks alot!!!
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joseph s 03-18-2014 03:07
it was the starter ground the clip that is mounted on the motor right side it has a little black box with one wire
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Nojodas67 03-18-2014 03:14
Quoting joseph s:
it was the starter ground the clip that is mounted on the motor right side it has a little black box with one wire

The starter does not have a ground, the starter is grounded through the starter casing.
The ground you are describing is the COIL GROUND that I've been trying to get you to find and check for the past several days.
Glad you finally found it. Good job.
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joseph s 03-18-2014 03:18
yes the coil ground sorry about that now all i got to figure out is where the two plugs go that i dont know? one of them is my thermostat plug but i dont know where it goes? can find pics of the wiring for the sensors/
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Nojodas67 03-18-2014 03:39
I just found a picture of a 2.3L engine on the web with coil-pack setup like yours; green arrow is coil ground connector that you were missing.
Red arrow is location of the temp sending unit (next to heater hose outlet, under coil pack).

http://i1336.photobucket.com/albums/o656/nojodas67/DSCF3695_zps2a37b677.jpg

By The Way: When referring to a location on this engine, the part of the engine where the crankshaft pulley and all the other pulleys are located is the "front" of the engine. The coil-pack is in the "rear" of the engine, not the side. The intake manifold is on the "left side", exhaust manifold is on the "right side" of the engine.
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joseph s 03-18-2014 03:45
ok ill try to check tomorrow. so its on the right side of the motor? can u find a pic of the plug itself?
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Nojodas67 03-18-2014 03:55
Found one! red arrow:
http://i1336.photobucket.com/albums/o656/nojodas67/_12_zps79c48e3e.jpg
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Tracy 03-18-2014 05:28
Does the ford engine interchange with the 2006 mazdaspeed 6?
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joseph s 03-18-2014 12:40
cool i see it, hopefully when i go to the car i find it for real! my battery is dead i dont know if its a dead battery cell because i charged it over night. drove it yesterday then today i try to start it and battery is dead. my alternator plug the clip broke. but the clip is plugged in and feels snug. idk if it is the alternator or just the battery. i think i need a new battery because when i was driving i didnt see any battery light. so i believe the alternator still works. but it got 190000 miles on all accessories and the body of the car
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joseph s 03-18-2014 20:53
ok so the thermostat sensor does not want to clip on? they are the same. it lines up and everything the wiring harness clip will not insert? the car when i come to a complete stop when coming to idle 700rpm it drops below 500rpm it dies out. it does this frequently because i live in the city..:( i think there maybe some rubber stuck in idler pulley? is there a way to adjust idle? if i run the a/c the car would die for sure something must be messing with my idle pulley... i need the thermostat but it will not inset into its plug?
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joseph s 03-18-2014 22:08
could the problem of dieing on idle be that the throttle body has carbon deposit? be cause i didnt swap my original one over i think thats what im going to check next to see if it will fix the idle
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joseph s 03-19-2014 23:07
good new i figured out all plugs! and the iding. car is running and driving perfect! no check engine light!!!! now i need to figure out why the front driver side turn signal isnt working any ideas? i replaced the bulb and still nothing? all other turn signals work
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Nojodas67 03-19-2014 23:27
Quoting joseph s:
good new i figured out all plugs! and the iding. car is running and driving perfect! no check engine light!!!! now i need to figure out why the front driver side turn signal isnt working any ideas? i replaced the bulb and still nothing? all other turn signals work

What was the missing plug for? And tell us the location.
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joseph s 03-20-2014 02:44
ok so the thermo plug had a plastic clip inside the clip that was the reason it would plug up. the plug that is in the front i still dont know is unknown, but the car is perfect now im satisfied. to bill your best bet for your budget would be to buy a 06-09 ford fusion but you need to keep your old motor to swap over all major parts crankshaft pulley, crank position sensor, timing cover, and the most important your intake cam the 04 mazda 6 is 5 cog timing layout the 06-09 fusion is 6 cog timing different layout motor will not run unless you put 04 mazda intake cam. my swap cost me allot of money....;( 1700$ for a 2007 mazda 6 for motor & tranny 45000 miles fusion is cheaper also note when you take your intake cam off.(mine was scored)(190000 mi) bought brand new intake and exhaust cams for 300$ new. about 600$ in labor if you got connections :) you can do it yourself with the absolute timing kit on ebay 40$ for the timing and just swap everything over.
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joseph s 03-20-2014 02:45
its allot of work but totally worth it. i am happy for this guide because i found an awsome deal when i found this guide a mazda motor just the motor they were trying to charge me 1500$ & the ford fusion would be your best bet but you need to use all your mazda parts because thats what you will be using. i have a 2004 mazda 6 & put a 2007 mazda 6 motor & tranny into the 04 works like a dream, the only thing is the car thinks its five speed so when six speed activates the car shakes a lil but it is an awsome gas saver. this guide makes me want to do swaps for anyone with a mazda 6!!!!! the guide made it easy and well worth the time and wait :)
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Steven 03-22-2014 17:36
Hey I need a hand I did the fusion swap in my 05 mazda 6 changed all the ignition stuff I have compression and spark and fuel but won't fire Any ideas?
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Nojodas67 03-22-2014 18:10
"changed all the ignition stuff" Can you please be more specific and tell us exactly what you did so I have a better idea what you're working with.

Did you check fuel pressure at the injectors or just the rail? I would check that you have fuel spray at all 4 injectors? You can easily remove the fuel rail with the injectors attached to the rail, place a large towel over the engine, crank it over and visually check that all 4 injectors are spraying. I encountered the same issue in one of my early swaps, I did not mark which throttle body I removed from the old engine and confused it with the Fusion throttle body, and engine would not start. I checked spark...Ok, checked compression...O K, checked fuel at rail...ok, checked injectors and only 2 of the injectors sprayed. I swapped throttle bodies then all 4 injectors sprayed...I put it back together and fired right up.

If you have all 4 injectors spraying correctly, then engine has to be out of time. Check the valve timing again with the correct timing tools. It is possible to insert the TDC stud into the side of the block in the car. Remove the passenger side halfshaft carrier bolts, this allows you to move the halfshaft about 1/2" away from the block which is enough clearance to insert the TDC stud to verify TDC. Checking TDC with screwdriver in the #1 spark plug hole IS NOT accurate, and not the correct way to do it on this engine.
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steven 03-22-2014 19:18
I changed the intake cam, plugs, wires, camshaft sensor, crank shaft sensor, timing cover, crank pulley. I know its times right I double and triple checked it cranks and has spark on all 4 cylinders. I am goanna try the fuel rail and injectors now will post back I 20 min or so
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steven 03-22-2014 19:51
so i pulled the injectors and number one and two fire once when i crank but they don't fire again number 3 and 4 are working the injectors are not that old either.... any ideas?
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steven 03-22-2014 20:12
i allso didnt get a intake or throttle body with the fusion motor it was a bare block and head
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Nojodas67 03-22-2014 23:03
Quoting steven:
i allso didnt get a intake or throttle body with the fusion motor it was a bare block and head

Make sure the ISC connector is plugged in securely.

Also, disconnect the battery positive AND negative cables, touch the two cables together to dissipate any left over charge. Then after 30 mins. or so the ECM should reset, then re-attach the battery cables and try to start it again.
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Nojodas67 03-22-2014 22:59
Bingo! Just like I suspected. The problem is NOT your injectors, it's an electronic mismatch. That is exactly what was happening to one of the very first swaps I did. After scratching my head for a while, double checking and triple checking everything, I noticed the date stamp on the label of the ISC module (attached to the throttle body), and it was the wrong year ('08 like the Fusion motor). As a last resort, I walked over to the old motor, removed the ISC ('05) and put it on the Fusion motor and it fired right up.

Unfortunately, if you only got a long block and no intake manifold at all, then I don't know what it could be for you. Double check the date stamp on the ISC label. Make sure you are using the '05 cam sensor, '05 crank sensor, '05 ISC of course, and that all the wiring matches.

Also, a lot of people have missed and forgot to attach one or more of the ground leads that are near the thermostat housing (this has caused a lot of no-start conditions for people doing this swap). Just retrace your steps and check every single connection again. I bet it's something very simple, like in my case. Several people have also written to me with their no-starts and it turned out to be a missed connection to the intake manifold shutter valve. It's rather hard to see, especially when you pull-out/put-in the engine through the top, instead of the front.

Good luck, and let us know when you figure it out.
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Nojodas67 03-22-2014 23:06
(Correction) In post above, omit "thermostat housing" and replace with "heater hose outlet at the rear of the cylinder head".
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Steven 03-23-2014 16:10
Got the car going turns out I had te intake cam in wrong had to turn it 180 thanks for the help and amazing guid
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Nojodas67 03-24-2014 17:49
Quoting Steven:
Got the car going turns out I had te intake cam in wrong had to turn it 180 thanks for the help and amazing guid

Glad you got it figured out. Remember to only use full synthetic oil in these engines, sludge build-up is a big problem with these.
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Rich 03-25-2014 18:32
I have a 2005 Mazda 6 2.3 that I am trying to find an engine for. I called a junk yard that has a fusion engine and they told me that it is not close to being the same they said the block and cylinder head is not the same. I am scared about getting an engine that will not work even with the changes that are stated here. Please tell me if there has been anyone that could not make this work.
Could you tell if all the 2005 changes would need to be made if I have a coil on each plug I think this was one of the changes for 2006
Thanks Rich
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Nojodas67 03-26-2014 01:42
Ok... I think this needed to be said for everyone's benefit. There is NO DOUBT that this swap works, as there have been many success stories about it, not just on this forum but on many... many other forums such as Mazda6, Mazda3, Mazda-Forum, MazdaSpeed, etc. The only reason that most of those people have been able to get their cars back on the road is because of the low cost of the Fusion engines. A used Mazda 2.3L with low miles can run upwards of $2,200, and that's for a "used" engine; whereas a late-model Fusion/Milan engine can be purchased for around $500-900 depending on the miles.

This website was intended to help the little guys get their cars back on the road, and not for Salvage yards to make a killing on used Fusion engines too. So, for everyone that's reading this, most Salvage yards still think that this swap is not possible, so PLEASE do not prove them wrong, otherwise we can all count on the cost of used Fusion/Milan motors to triple in price, especially since all salvage yards are now interconnected; the word of this swap (along with the price hike) will spread like wildfire.
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Rich 03-25-2014 23:39
Any idea how many hrs. it would take for a 2005 swap
Thanks Rich
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Nojodas67 03-26-2014 01:45
Quoting Rich:
Any idea how many hrs. it would take for a 2005 swap
Thanks Rich

Rich, to answer your question: the swap does work so go ahead and purchase a Fusion motor (hush about your plans), read the entire guide (step by step); then post your question(s) in case you get stuck (but please only AFTER you've studied this guide thoroughly, also read the posts from other users as your question was most likely already been addressed). The time it takes to do this depends on your skill set. I have done over a dozen Mazda6 swaps, so for me it's about 4.5 hrs. start to finish.

Good luck and be sure to let us know how it goes, and share anything that you think others may benefit from.
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joseph s 03-26-2014 12:35
rich the fusion motor will work it is the same engine but heres the difference you need to swap your intake cam!!!!! and all your major sensors and the timing cover and crank pulley. you are putting all your mazda parts on the fusion. all of the major sensor parts. the easy way is take your motor out when you have both motors on the ground swap all the major and misl. parts you are making your mazda read the motor by the timing and all of its mazda parts. for me to swap my motor i did it the hard way. i took the whole front off so i could pullthe motor forward with the hoist. and i put the motor in without swapping parts!(dumb ass) took me about two days taking old motor and putting new one and about another day to swap all the parts. because i had the motor all ready in the car. so it made it a bit more difficult so swap parts with both motors on the ground and you should be ok! not a pro but i def, am a mechanic and it is possible and the fusion is the cheap perfect way to get a running motor that works in your mazda. i am trying to find people in orlando that want to do this swap because i had fun doing it. and it was well worth the time, $ , and wait!!!
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joseph s 03-26-2014 13:49
if you find the right guy at a salvage yard i found a 2007 mazda 6 motor 45000 miles he wanted 1100$ for the motor and 600$ for tranny i bought both! and put it into a 2004 mazda 6 with swapping all of my 2004 mazda 6 parts onto the 2007 including the intake cam swap and everything works! only thing is when it activates in last gear i feel the car shake because the six speed has activated but the car think is its a 5 speed its no biggie tho! its cool to know that the 07 tranny works on the 04 model! ford fusion is maybe cheaper but you dont really know how many miles they have i was able to see the motor in the original car and was able to hear it run before it was pulled.
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KTMguy 04-01-2014 23:25
I found a great deal on a fusion motor with very low miles but the problem is one of the bosses on the head is broken. I'm not sure yet if it could be weld up but I was thinking worse case my head casting on my Mazda 2.3 would be the same and I just wanted to verify if I'm correct in assuming that.
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nojodas67 04-01-2014 23:57
Nope. oil passages for VVT supply are different. Your Mazda head will not work on the Fusion block.
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KTMguy 04-01-2014 23:29
Oh and the fusion motor is a 06 and my Mazda motor is 04.
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KTMguy 04-02-2014 21:15
Thanks for the answer! Found out its the upper motor mount that attaches to the timing cover is where it broke and they are unaware that its really the timing cover and not the actual head. The motor mount broke away pulling one of the motor mount studs out of the timing cover. There ignorance make a great deal for me!
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nojodas67 04-02-2014 23:17
Quoting KTMguy:
Thanks for the answer! Found out its the upper motor mount that attaches to the timing cover is where it broke and they are unaware that its really the timing cover and not the actual head. The motor mount broke away pulling one of the motor mount studs out of the timing cover. There ignorance make a great deal for me!

You don't need the Fusion timing cover anyway because you have to use the Mazda cover.
Good luck.
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KTMguy 04-03-2014 18:10
Yep that I know. But im unsure about the actuators being the same or not. The fusion motor im buying is very low miles so I had planned on using the Fusions Actuator when I transfer the cam from the Mazda. That is if there the same!
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KTMguy 04-02-2014 23:00
Another question....are the VVT actuators the same between the fusion and the mazda?

Thanks
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Rich 04-04-2014 01:48
Today I was able to purchase a 2006 fusion engine with 7,600 miles on it. I will post how the swap goes, I am so happy that I was able to find one with such low milage I hope its a good sign. My original engine is a 2005 and the timing chain skipped and took out the valves
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Rich 04-14-2014 01:45
I want to thank everyone that put this great blog together without it I would have sold my car. The detailed information made the job doable for my mechanic. I used car-parts.com to find my fusion engine and what an amazing find that I was able to purchase. The engine was a 2006 fusion engine with 7,600 miles on it. One part of the change over that was a surprise is that my 2005 engine had 6 teeth on the cam but my mechanic still changed it. Basically my mechanic used most of my mazda parts so it looks just like the original engine. He did try and use the fuel system from the ford engine but it will not work so do not try. When he used all my mazda fuel system it started up very quick. I have about 50 miles on it so far and it runs great so quiet and the check engine never came on once it was started. I just want to say if anyone does this change find a mechanic that is not in a rush. He told me that it would be ease to goof up the timing and the change could turn out very bad. So if anyone one needs a great mechanic I know where to find one in upstate NY.
Thank you thank you
Rich
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nojodas67 04-14-2014 03:27
Quoting Rich:
One part of the change over that was a surprise is that my 2005 engine had 6 teeth on the cam but my mechanic still changed it.
Thank you thank you
Rich

Even though I'm not the originator of this guide, I have contributed for a while now. You're welcome and I'm glad it worked out for you. Just do not let salvage yards know about it.
Your mechanic did not have to use the Mazda cam. You would have been better off with the Fusion cam since it obviously has very little wear, compared to the original Mazda camshaft. Just keep the Fusion cam in case you have to change it out.
Good luck.
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Artem Vestsorov 04-14-2014 13:17
Nice to see another success story. Your comment about the Fusion fuel system not working is not entirely true. I'm running the Fusion fuel injectors and fuel rail on my 06 Mazda 6. The Fusion fuel parts should have worked for you as well seeing as you have a 2005. The injectors are the same on all first gen Mazda 2.3 engines. Fuel rails are the same in 05-08 while the 03 - 04 had a different fuel rail with an external fuel pressure regulator. Finally, all first gens 2.3s had the same fuel quick disconnect hose. Guess that's one more thing I can add to the guide :)
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nojodas67 04-14-2014 14:24
Quoting Artem Vestsorov:
The injectors are the same through on all first gen Mazda 2.3 engines. Fuel rails are the same in 05-08 while the 03 - 04 had a different fuel rail with an external fuel pressure regulator. Finally, all first gens 2.3s had the same fuel quick disconnect hose.

You are correct, fuel injectors and fuel rails are the same. In all my swaps I've always left the Fusion injectors and fuel rails intact; I figured the Fusion injectors had less mileage, age, and wear on them, so I just left them alone. He probably meant that the Fusion throttle body would not work with the Mazda ECM so he had to swap them. Although I don't think the throttle body can be considered part of the fuel system in port fuel injected engines, as is the case in throttle-body injection engines.
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Rich 04-15-2014 02:22
I will have to talk to my mechanic but I think he only tried the the fusion rails together with the throttle body. I have to say the new set up is so quiet that I hear noises in the car that i did not hear before lol.
Thanks again
Rich
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Rich 04-16-2014 00:47
I did check with my mechanic and he told me that he tried my throttle body with the fusion injectors and there was no pulse and would not start. When he put the mazda injectors on it the engine fired right up. I do not know why the fusion parts did not work for him I just wanted to let you guys know.
Thanks Rich
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nojodas67af 04-16-2014 01:48
Quoting Rich:
I did check with my mechanic and he told me that he tried my throttle body with the fusion injectors and there was no pulse and would not start. When he put the mazda injectors on it the engine fired right up. I do not know why the fusion parts did not work for him I just wanted to let you guys know.
Thanks Rich

Thanks for letting us know, but that makes no sense. It makes no difference which injectors are used. But I do know that the Fusion throttle body will not work with the Mazda ECM; maybe he's confused and meant to say he tried the Fusion throttle body and there was no pulse on the injectors, which has happened to me. But as soon as I swapped out the throttle body for the Mazda unit, it fired right up.
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Jordan S 04-19-2014 23:36
Hi, Just wanted to thank you for your post. it inspired me to replace the engine my self and save $1000 on labor, luckily i found an engine for my mazda 6 2.3l for $1000 with 180k on it . mine had 240K with a blown rod.Ive already took out the engine, replaced parts and today i put the other engine back in but haven't bolted it yet. have some issues with the exhaust manifold, but should be okay, i followed all your steps and everything went smoothly, BTW this is my first engine work and im surprised of how much i was capable of with just a jack stand and an engine hoist. lol i was wondering if someone could send me some detailed pictures of the engine bay transmission side wiring harness and tubes to where they connect. its been a while and i cant remember some of the connection points. my email is

Thank you
ss
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joseph s 04-20-2014 01:42
ok for the exhaust manifold i found that jacking the motor up just a little bit to angle and shake it to where you can get the rod that is sticking out to be able to slide in. pretty easy but i had experienced the same thing or you can take the manifold off and do it that way but it more work. and for the hoses you should have two hose for trans that go to the bottom f radiator which cools trans oil there is another hose where the trans dipstick is. wiring harness is self explanatory match up all of them there is no matching plugs on trans. it has there own i know there are two in the front for shifting and tiptronic also i believe there is one or two in the back. if you have anymore questions feel free to email me! i put a 07 motor and trans in my 2004 mazda 6 had to swap intake cams to make it work pretty awsome i paid 1700$ for motor and tranny and did everything on this guide i am the mechanic! and ive been up and running no probs for a month now also my motor has 45000 miles when i bought it. i was able to hear it run in the original car before i bought it. my car body has 190000 miles
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joseph s 04-20-2014 01:58
also a motor with 180k is not much of a big difference from 240k you should have bought a fusion motor cheaper and lower miles. think about it how long is this motor going to last? my motor started knocking at 190k but the car it was already bought without my knowledge of the purchase. my wife made the decision by trusting a guy in getting us a good car. wrong he skrewed us over and put money in his pocket i found out he paid 2500$ for the car and i know he knew the motor was knocking thats why he paid that price and my wife gave him 3500$ so he put a 1000$ in his pocket. then after i got home from work i found out and raised hell and he blamed it on me. that i messed with it and fucked it up. bullshitter pissed me off!!!!! and i bought the motor and trans 1700$ about 300$ in new parts because my original intake cam with 190k was beat to shit! a brand new intake cam for the 04 model was 200$ and about 600$ in labor. im about 6k in my mazda 6. but i have a brand new car basically 2004 mazda 6i with a 2007 mada 6i motor and trans and i have 6 speed with the 07 excellent gas saver! i would recommend this for people that want to upgrade to new motors 03-08 only! you cannot have a newer car with older model. i mean you can but you have to do everything the same way the guide explains. im in orlando fl if anyone needs help with this swap im the guy to go to! lol i have everything needed! jack engine hoist tools!
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Bill Routley 04-22-2014 16:36
Just finished my grandsons 2004 Mazda 6 engine swap with a 2007 Fusion 2.3 . Thanks for a great guide. It wasn't 100 percent complete bit close enough that with the assistance of Nojodas67 the job went smoothly! He is a wealth of knowledge and savy with these swaps!! Also got the engine from him! Having never done one of these I practiced on the old engine! Only changed the parts you stated and used pre coil on plug ignition and sensors and front cover. No mention was made regarding using fusion VVT so timing chain teeth matched but Nojodas67 mentioned it before I had engine in car!! One more thing I removed entire front end of vehicle as he suggested. A real time saver as only takes about one hours to remove and than everything is so much easier to work on and a/c compressor, alt., power steering pump and belt is done on the engine hoist. Yes need to recharge a/c but no big deal!! Thanks again Happy Wrenching and Nojodas67 for saving us a ton of money and guiding me and grandson thru a fun project. Bill
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Steve 04-22-2014 17:20
Hey everyone,

I did my fusion swap and my car is idling like crap shuts off at lights the odd time to I have tried to many things I don't know what to try next. Tried replacing some of the parts intake can sensor, crank sensor, maf (from scrappers) new pcv valve and hose, cleaned throttle body and intake manifold, new intake filter to. Anyone run into the same issue or have any ideas?
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nojodas67 04-22-2014 22:25
Would you please let us know what you mean by "crap"? Does it surge at a steady rate or pattern? Does it idle too low, too high, or just erratic idle with no apparent pattern.

Is the check engine light on? If so, list the codes here.
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Steve 04-23-2014 21:20
It idles low and then bounces around between 200 and 2000 then shuts off and shakes the car when it idles for a few seconds but no codes
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nojodas67 04-24-2014 04:14
Quoting Steve:
It idles low and then bounces around between 200 and 2000 then shuts off and shakes the car when it idles for a few seconds but no codes

What year car, what year Fusion engine, and exactly what Mazda parts and Fusion parts are you using? Did you follow the timing procedure very closely?
Does it feel like it's not firing on all cylinders? It could be out of valve timing, wrong parts swapped, large vacuum leak, or a number of other issues. We need a better description and history in order to diagnose it over the internet.
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joseph s 04-26-2014 19:09
help! ok so i did the swap a month ago and got the car running and driving no problem but i did put a 2007 motor and tranny in my 04 mazda 6. so the car was running and driving no prob for a good 2000 miles. then one day i went for a drive and i pushed it a little then all of a sudden i felt a little jerk then the engine light came on then the battery light then instantly the car died. it cranks but wont start. i found out im not getting spark. i replaced coil and still nothing. i dont know what is the problem? i need help now the car isnt running i called a bunch of people and no one knows the cause of why it doesnt run. i had one guy tell me it could be the ecu im coming on here for help because im lost on figuring out why is there no spark? all wires are tight and connected like i said the car was running no prob. for a good 2000 miles all of a sudden car dies and i have no spark... please help
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joseph s 04-26-2014 19:12
steve it sounds like your throttle body. did you reuse your throttle body or the one from the motor you bought?
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Sam 04-26-2014 21:03
Hello, and thank you for this guide, post and comments. I need help. I have a 2008 Mazda6 that we swapped with a its engine with a 2007 ford fusion 2.3 engine. The car starts and drives 2 issues with it the check engine light is on with p0011 ( camshaft position, timing over advanced) , and the car turns off when stopping especially at traffic lights ( when it is in gear (D)). During the swap we changed the pulley, timing and crank sensors. Also, checked the cams, and cogs, and they were the same. We used the Mazda throttle body with the above results. when we switch to the fusion throttle body the car wont even start. Any idea as for check engine light and the dying when stopping issue? Any help would be appreciated -Sam
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joseph s 04-26-2014 21:11
did you make sure to lock your crank and cams prior to removing the crank pulley bolt without doing so it will throw it off time.. i would make sure your time is exact. when i had dying when stopping it was my throttle body. did you clean it?
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Sam 04-26-2014 21:26
Joseph, thank you for the response. We used the ford tool, and we locked the cams. Unfortunately, it didn't occur to me to clean the throttle body before installing it, but I will do that on Monday and check. Do I use a timing gun to test the timing? Is there anything else that could cause that code to appear?
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joseph s 04-27-2014 13:04
also did you lock the crankshaft. thats the most important! to test the timing spin the crank till the cams line up to tdc. have read many post that before removing the crank pulley bolt they forgot to lock it. if you remove it without locking the crank it throws it off just a hair without you knowing. i believe your car will tell you that it is advanced because of that reason.
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Artem Vestsorov 04-28-2014 05:27
Sam, like joseph said, to test the timing you install the timing peg and rotate the crank until it hits the peg. Then you install the cam locking bar. And after that you install the bolt in the crank pulley. If you can install all three without problems then your timing is okay.

If you timing is okay then that code is thrown because the camshaft position sensor is reporting that the camshaft timing is advanced too much. That can be caused by a faulty Oil Control Valve and/or a bad VVT actuator. It can also be caused by too much slack in the chain. I would check and swap the OCV first since that is the easiest. The OCV is sticking out of the valve cover and is near the camshaft sprockets. Then check the VVT actuator. While you are doing either one of those, check the slack in the chain. Good luck.
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KTMguy 04-28-2014 20:28
Well just finished my swap of the 2006 Fusion motor in to my 2004 Mazda3 and it runs great! It started instantly and has run perfectly. As stated here I switch over the front cover, valve cover, oil pressure sensor, oil pan, intake manifold. I didn’t switch the cam because it was like new compared to the one in my old Mazda motor so I pressed off the timing cog from fusion intake cam and replaced it with the Mazda timing cog. I have about 50 miles on it so far and its running super. But I do have an error code (P0500) which I know is the error code for the transmission speed sensor. Its messing with the trans, speedo and power steering. So I have a little investigation around the sensor to make sure I didn’t damage the sensor or wiring in the swap somehow. I bought the car not running so it could have came with the faulty sensor. Anyway the motor swap went really smooth due to the info here and I just wanted to say thanks!!
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joseph s 04-28-2014 22:34
how did you press the cog off. would like to know! for future references because i went and bought a brand new intake cam... 200$ no cheap.. :( i didnt think you could do that? it would of saved me some money...
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KTMguy 04-28-2014 23:05
Yeah it would and in my case the original cam was showing some wear so I defiantly didnt want to put that in such a low mileage motor. I also didnt want to spend $200 when I had a like new cam in the Fusion motor. So I used my 20 ton press to push it off. The fit was not that tight so a lighter press would have no problem removing it too. I also scribed a couple marks on the cog ring that aligned to the cam timing position notch so I could locate its exact position on the fusion cam. To press it on the cam I used a socket that was a similar diameter to the cog and would go over the cam. I also took a measurement from the end of the cam to the cog so I could locate it exactly as it was. It worked perfect and the motor runs just as it should. The cams are defiantly exactly the same except for the ring of course.
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john 05-09-2014 05:03
OK so I swap a 2006 Fusion on my 2006 Mazda 6. Car won't start, check engine light on, traction light on, the only way I got it to start was by jump starting the starter . it started running rough then the idle seam to get better' tried to push on the gas pedal and it won't rev. Had to switch the crank sensor , the pulley and oil pressure sensors. Put all of the Mazda's wires on the fusion as well as the fusions had different connectors . but the only way I can start the car is by jumping the starter aka screwdriver trick
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Artem Vestsorov 05-09-2014 08:08
Are you using the Mazda or Fusion throttle body? You'll have to use the Mazda one.
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john 05-12-2014 02:16
Fusion throttle body
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Artem Vestsorov 05-12-2014 07:26
Car won't start with the Fusion throttle body. Switch it out and you should be good.
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nojodas67 05-09-2014 13:39
Quoting john:
OK so I swap a 2006 Fusion on my 2006 Mazda 6. Car won't start, check engine light on, traction light on, the only way I got it to start was by jump starting the starter . it started running rough then the idle seam to get better' tried to push on the gas pedal and it won't rev. Had to switch the crank sensor , the pulley and oil pressure sensors. Put all of the Mazda's wires on the fusion as well as the fusions had different connectors . but the only way I can start the car is by jumping the starter aka screwdriver trick

Did this Mazda6 run Prior to swapping the motor or did you purchase a non-running car?
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john 05-12-2014 02:17
Mazda was running it had the infamous knock, so I bought the fusion motor a running a tested one
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john 05-12-2014 19:40
ARTEM! ! And NOJODAS! !! Thank you for putting the guide and offering support! It turns out that underneath the air filter box there was a connection that I over looked and yes the throttle body need it to be changed . Car has a slight knocking almost like Hondas do. Wondering if that's normal
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nojodas67 05-12-2014 22:54
Quoting john:
ARTEM! ! And NOJODAS! !! Thank you for putting the guide and offering support! It turns out that underneath the air filter box there was a connection that I over looked and yes the throttle body need it to be changed . Car has a slight knocking almost like Hondas do. Wondering if that's normal

You're welcome. Glad it worked out for you.
If you're hearing lifter noise, when engines have been sitting in the junk yard without being run for a while, the lifters will leak down and make noise after the engine is started, but this noise will quiet down after the engine has been run for a while. Just let it idle for an hour and it should clear up, do not rev the engine up until the lifters have a chance to fill up again. You can also add half a quart of trans fluid to the oil, the extra detergent in trans fluid will clean out all the oil passages and free up the lifters.
If what you're hearing is not lifter noise, it's probably just the injectors, which is normal.
Remember to use pure synthetic oil ONLY on these cars.
Good Luck.
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John Mollohan 06-13-2014 19:54
Recently did the swap on my 03 mazda- noticed that I left the bolt out out of the bracket that runs from under the exhaust manifold down to the block where it is secured with a bolt,,,,can anyone tell me what size that bolt this exactly so I can get a replacement or if there is a place on the car where I can steal the bolt from-the engine and bracket are hitting each other during turns stops or starts, just replaced the torque strut yesterday and still have some noise that I know is coming from that area!!! any help would b awesome!!!
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DB 06-14-2014 03:16
Hi again Nojodas. Many months ago you gave me recommendations (above in this chain of messages) for me about my 2008 6 that had a 2005 engine installed which runs rough with mild to medium vibrations at all rpms.

I looked into having someone take of the valve cover and check timing but they where saying it would be hundreds of dollars to even look. I did have a dealer mechanic have a quick look under the hood and he was certain that me having the older 2005 engine in the 2008 car would have unfix-able timing issues. I am not sure if he meant valve timing or otherwise. He said you cant swap to older model engines and have it work perfectly. Like I have said previously the vibration and slightly loud sound at any rpm is not extreme but it is certainly more than subtle.

I starting to think about getting rid of this engine and having someone do the ford engine swap. What I am wondering is that if I have a 2005 mazda engine would that be something I could sell/trade without having an actual provable engine mileage to show someone? I know that you gave me the VIN for this engine after I gave you the engine serial. That would only tell me the mileage before it was installed in my car and I have no idea at what point they put it in.

Please let me know if you have any thoughts.

Thank you
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nojodas67 06-17-2014 16:44
Without actually checking the timing on your engine by going through the procedure, you're just guessing at what it could be. I would start with a timing check, without that I'm afraid there's not much to do. You will either have to pay someone to do it, or check it yourself with the proper tools and the procedure listed here.
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DB 06-18-2014 19:23
OK. Point taken.

Thanks again.
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Eric 03-16-2017 02:38
Hey nojodas67, I had a quick question. I got the new engine and as you said before my 05 had the 06 engine so no need to switch the cam shafts which is awesome. So I started the procedure to switch over the crank pully and I followed all the directions but I might have missed a step. In the directions it says "to turn the crank shaft 1 3/4 turns then install the timing peg. What I did was I turned it two full turns (whereits back at the TDC) and then installed all the tools. All the tools Timing Peg, M6 Bolt, and Camshaft alignment Plate fit simultaneously. Did I mess up?
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Nojodas67 03-16-2017 04:15
Quoting Eric:
Hey nojodas67, I had a quick question. I got the new engine and as you said before my 05 had the 06 engine so no need to switch the cam shafts which is awesome. So I started the procedure to switch over the crank pully and I followed all the directions but I might have missed a step. In the directions it says "to turn the crank shaft 1 3/4 turns then install the timing peg. What I did was I turned it two full turns (whereits back at the TDC) and then installed all the tools. All the tools Timing Peg, M6 Bolt, and Camshaft alignment Plate fit simultaneously. Did I mess up?

Maybe not. Just back up the crankshaft a few degrees, then verify the timing peg is seated all the way in. You can then turn the crankshaft clockwise again so the crankshaft balance weight is tight against the timing peg; Now you know you're exactly at TDC.
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Nojodas67 03-16-2017 04:34
Also, be sure to watch this video (JohnC's video), he does a pretty good job of explaining how to use the timing peg and the other timing tools.
DO NOT SKIP any steps: do it right and it will run...do it wrong and you will be doing it again, guaranteed.
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eric 03-16-2017 04:51
Quoting Nojodas67:
Also, be sure to watch this video (JohnC's video), he does a pretty good job of explaining how to use the timing peg and the other timing tools.
DO NOT SKIP any steps: do it right and it will run...do it wrong and you will be doing it again, guaranteed.

DO you have the link to the video? I cant seem to find it.
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eric 03-16-2017 04:49
Quoting Nojodas67:
Quoting Eric:
Hey nojodas67, I had a quick question. I got the new engine and as you said before my 05 had the 06 engine so no need to switch the cam shafts which is awesome. So I started the procedure to switch over the crank pully and I followed all the directions but I might have missed a step. In the directions it says "to turn the crank shaft 1 3/4 turns then install the timing peg. What I did was I turned it two full turns (whereits back at the TDC) and then installed all the tools. All the tools Timing Peg, M6 Bolt, and Camshaft alignment Plate fit simultaneously. Did I mess up?

Maybe not. Just back up the crankshaft a few degrees, then verify the timing peg is seated all the way in. You can then turn the crankshaft clockwise again so the crankshaft balance weight is tight against the timing peg; Now you know you're exactly at TDC.


So the part that confuses me is the 1 3/4 turn. I turned it 1 3/4 turns (so the hole in the crank pully is at 3 o'clock) at this point it says to install the cam alignment plate but you cant because the cams aren't in the right position. If you turn a little more to where the hole is back at the 6 o'clock position the cams are aligned and everything fits. I'm going to watch that video now and see how he did it.
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Nojodas67 03-16-2017 12:47
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5NzKdAQ4iI
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nojodas67 06-17-2014 16:47
I still have for sale a low-mileage (56k) Fusion engine that will fit 2003-2008 year Mazda6.
If interested respond with your zip code and I will get a shipping quote to your door.
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Brent 06-20-2014 02:01
I was curious if anyone could give me some advice. I just finished up my second fusion to mazda 2.3 swap. Followed everything described in the articles. The car starts , runs and idles great but it sets the code p0012 camshaft position-timing over-retarded (bank one). I swapped the vvt solenoid but did not help. verified all the timing with correct tools and everything is good. Thanks in advance.Anyone have any ideas?
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Brent 06-20-2014 02:03
I forgot to mention the engine was out of a 2006 fusion. The Mazda is a 2004 .
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Artem Vestsorov 06-21-2014 21:49
Other than timing I would make sure that the camshaft sensor is clean and also swap it with the old one just to rule it out. When you said you swapped the solenoid I'm assuming you are talking about the OCV, oil control valve (the thing sticking out of the valve cover with an electrical plug). Did you reset the ECU when you swapped it by unplugging the battery? That needs to be done. Also make sure you have 12 volts at the OCV plug. You can also apply 12 volts to the OCV and see if it moves.
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jim 06-21-2014 01:17
please help me . i need to know how long the timing peg is to set top dead center on my 2.3 motor from my Mazda 6. i am a machinist and i will need to use it only one time . if any one has one of these tool please take a caliper and measure how long it is from the bottom of the head to the end of the threads. thank you for the help. please send me what you got. thank you for the help.
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Artem Vestsorov 06-21-2014 20:58
Just measured my timing peg ( got the kit from MassiveSpeedSys tem). The overall length of the peg is 1.9011 inches - the length of the head .4029 inches = 1.4982 inches (38.0543 mm) which is the portion that goes into the block. That reading was taken three times with a micrometer. I read on another forum that someone got a reading of 1.510 inches on theirs. Hope this helps.
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Robbms6 06-21-2014 11:28
I have a 2006 Mazdaspeed 6 (turbo, all-wheel drive) with a blown motor. Can this motor be swapped with a 2.3L fusion engine? I understand its the smae block, but am concerned about ECU, wiring harness, and other possible problems. Thanks
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Artem Vestsorov 06-21-2014 21:19
Short answer is that it will not work. There are many differences between the regular 2.3 and the 2.3 DISI. Different heads, different fuel system, different wiring harness, stronger internals to handle boost, etc.
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steve 06-26-2014 01:17
I just wanted to thank you for this most helpful post! I bought a 2004 Mazda6 (2.3L) with a rod hanging out the side of the block. I bought a really clean fusion motor (for 350) and followed the instructions to a T. Just started the car and it runs like a top!!!!

I did everything you said to do and it worked perfectly! Swapped the cam, intake, timing chain cover, front pulley, oil pan, and sensors.

The biggest problem was the driver's side half shaft. It gave me a really hard time coming out, and a harder time going back in. I ended buying a 2' piece of 4" PVC and sliding it over the axle to get a uniform contact point with the cv closest to the trans and gave it one good whack with a 10lb sledge and it knocked right in.

After hooking everything up and filling it with fluids, it started on the 3rd try and purred like a kitten!!!

One recommendation I would recommend to everyone is to us a Haynes manual (or Chilton) to make sure you are torquing all of the nuts and bolts to proper spec. I was amazed at how "loose" the specs were, but then I realized you are dealing with Aluminum!

I would consider myself more than just a casual mechanic, but I did this and it worked out great! You can do it to!! I should make a good buck or two on this car.

Would definitely do it again. Thanks again for the info. I can truly say, it was invaluable!!
~s
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Artem Vestsorov 06-29-2014 06:12
You're welcome :) Always nice to hear success stories.
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Dennis G 06-27-2014 23:59
Artem and Nojodas, it's guys like you that make the internet so awesome! I just bought a 2005 Mazda 6 with 112k miles in great shape for a great price, but after 300 miles slight ticking has grown into an unbearable knock, and mechanic says I need new engine for $3200 ($2250 for engine, $950 labor). I found your article and a 2007 Fusion engine 60 miles away with less than 50k miles for $1400 less than used Mazda engine. Mechanic is skeptical says he has never heard of doing this, but is willing to swap components. He is not will to make any custom modifications or "re-program" any software. He does not think this is as easy as I made it sound. I do not have the tools or the time, and I am wondering how much extra time I should expect to get billed for swapping all the components compared to putting in the same Mazda engine like he wants to. Thank you both again for being so generous with your time :)
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Artem Vestsorov 06-29-2014 06:11
I can't really say how much extra time you would get billed for but the bulk of the work is swapping the intake camshaft and everything that goes along with that (swapping timing covers, crank pulley, re-timing the engine). I would ask him for an estimate on that. Hopefully he has the correct timing tools and I also recommend that you buy a new crank bolt; do not use the old one.
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Dennis G 07-01-2014 16:24
Nojodas67 (John): so you live west of Chicago? I have a one-ton truck and a 20' car hauler, and I have to go to Chicago in August. Any chance I could drop off my '05 Mazda 6 with a replacement engine for a week and pay you to swap them? It would be worth the extra gas to get somebody who is comfortable doing it right and who could tell me the exact cost up front, and frankly since I wouldn't be considering this option if not for the generosity of you and Artem, I would be happy to see you make some money. Let me know if you are interested, and thanks again.
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nojodas67 09-17-2014 01:46
Quoting Dennis G:
Nojodas67 (John): so you live west of Chicago? I have a one-ton truck and a 20' car hauler, and I have to go to Chicago in August. Any chance I could drop off my '05 Mazda 6 with a replacement engine for a week and pay you to swap them? It would be worth the extra gas to get somebody who is comfortable doing it right and who could tell me the exact cost up front, and frankly since I wouldn't be considering this option if not for the generosity of you and Artem, I would be happy to see you make some money. Let me know if you are interested, and thanks again.

Sorry I have not been on this site for a while. If you still need to do the swap, let me know.
John
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Max 07-18-2014 01:38
Hi,i have 02/05 2005 Mazda 6 2.3l auto California model it has the round coil on plug the engine is bad. previews owner ran out of oil. so got me 01/05 2005 Mazda 6 2.3l auto as a parts car. is a non California model ( plug has wires). i swapped the engine and moved all the original electronics from old engine onto the new one. but now wont start. no spark...
do i have to swap pulley, cam, timing cover.....
Thanks.
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Artem Vestsorov 07-18-2014 11:28
Most likely yes. If one had coil on plug but the other had plugs and wires then I'm betting the crank pulley and sensor is different. Easy way to tell is to look at both crank sensors side by side, you will see the difference. I'm not sure about the cams though - you will have to remove the valve cover and check how many teeth they have.
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Max 07-18-2014 19:31
my old block has the oil passage to the vvt through the timing cover. the newer engines have the oil passage through block right? to change the pulley you have to change side cover. when i got the car the guy before me took the engine apart along with 4 other Mazda engines to fix it but he never did. so now i don't know witch pulley or cam is suppose to be on my California engine.
do you have any info what is the difference California engine vs non California?
also the crank position sensor is a 2 pin in my car. in order to swap to the newer pulley you have to have the 3 pin sensor so that wont work.
Do you know what cam im suppose to have in the engine. its a 02/05 engine with round coil on plug.
Thanks for helping me out.
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Artem Vestsorov 07-19-2014 17:25
You're in a tough spot since you cant compare your new engine parts with the old ones.

Yes, the older blocks had the oil passage through the timing cover while somewhere in 2005 they changed the oil passage to go through the block. You do not need to swap timing covers if you want to swap the pulleys. You DO need to swap the timing cover if you are swapping from the newer 2006+ crankshaft sensor because the sensor has slightly different mounting points.

As far as I know the California models have extra emission parts (secondary air pump, different exhaust manifold with an extra catalytic converter, and different ecu programming).

I can't say for certain which cam your engine is supposed to have. I'm assuming it is 5 teeth since the 6 teeth cam wasn't introduced until 06.
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Max 07-19-2014 18:32
ok. i know my stock engine came with the 2 wire crank position sensor so that means it used the older pulley, so i have that figured out.

do you know if the newer cam goes only with the newer crack pulley? or do they have engines with older crack pulley but 6 teeth cam?

also my coils are 2 pin connector, round ones. could it be that the engine requires 6 tooth cam for coil on plug?
Is it possible that they use older cam and pulley but the ecu is programmed for individual coil.
the coils are different from the 6+ years, they used 3 pin coils,
im thinking that maybe because the newer engines used a 3 pin coils, they required more specific info from pulley and camshaft triger wheels for ecu.
Big Thanks for helping me out.

more info. when i got the car the guy gave me the correct block. the serial number matches the vin.
but the head is token apart, along with all the other parts he gave me, he gave me a newer intake camshaft. i dont know if this camshaft came from the engine form the car or form one of the other engines that he took apart.
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Max 07-19-2014 18:47
Also what do you mean i don't have to swap timing cover if what to swap pulleys? from what i know the older and newer pulleys trigger wheels are different size in diameter and have a different teeth design. the newer ones have a bigger trigger wheel and more empty spaces.
did they make 2 different pulleys to fit the older engines with the 2 pin crack position sensor?
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Artem Vestsorov 07-19-2014 23:38
You are right, there is the old style crank pulley (2003-2005) that has one empty space on the trigger wheel and the new style (2006+) that has a larger trigger wheel with three empty spaces.

As far as I can tell, you have the 2 pin crank sensor so you should also have the old style crank pulley with one space on the trigger wheel.

I did find something very interesting when I was looking up OEM part numbers. If jimellismazdapa rts.com is correct, then the 2005 California engines have the L3E312420 (6 teeth) camshaft while the non California models have the L30912420 (5 teeth) camshaft. My advice is to call up the dealer and see if they can confirm that with a VIN lookup. If the above is correct then you will have to swap out your 5 tooth cam to a 6 tooth.

If you do end up swapping cams and that fixes your problem can you let me know? That info would be very helpful for others. Good luck.
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Max 07-20-2014 00:05
Ok Thanks for the info. i will call, and will swap the cams and see what happens. ill keep you updated.
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Ken 07-29-2014 13:05
I've been trying to do as much research as I can because I can't find a fusion engine anywhere, and I can get this Mazda 3 engine for free (just have to pull it out). What timing cover would I have to put on it? Why won't my 2006 cover fit? Is their a sensor that plugs into it that wont fit now? I understand that this older engine has different internal oil passages, but if it ran well in the 2004, why wont it now? Can you also explain why the oil pan needs to be changed? Does it also have a senor that needs to be plugged into it?

Thank you very very much for this help. I am REALLY hoping I can somehow make this 2004 engine work if possible.
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Artem Vestsorov 07-29-2014 16:57
Your 2006 timing cover does not have the oil passages that the earlier 2.3 engines need for the VVT system. When you go to swap in the 2004 engine you MUST use your 2006 cover because it has the correct mounting points for the 2006 crankshaft position sensor which you MUST also use. Yes, the cover will fit but the problem is that with the 2006 cover on the 2004 engine the VVT system will not work. In addition, since there is no place in the 2006 cover for the oil to flow through you will most likely cause a leak. Nojodas67 made it work by plugging up an oil hole (I don't know which one). But again, VVT was inoperable.

My comment about swapping the oil pan was based on the fact that the A/C compressor on the Mazda 3 is mounted under the oil pan and the oil pan is shaped to accommodate it. Now that I think about it, since the Mazda 6 has the A/C compressor mounted on the side of the block you may not have to swap the pans. Can't confirm for sure since I don't have a Mazda 3 to compare.
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Ken 07-29-2014 17:22
Thank you very very much for this help. Does anyone know how I can find out what hole to plug, and by what means to plug it? I am kinda stuck with this engine now and am going to have to try to make it work. I'm not sure what effects it has on the engine if I disable the VVT like he did, but I hope it doesn't throw a code that then wont let me pass emissions test.

Any help is good help guys. This is my first crack at this work.
Thanks again
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Neven 07-29-2014 18:37
Thank you for put this together Artem ...

I have a question ..I have 2007 Mazda 5 2.3L with bad connecting rod , is it possible to put 2007 Fusion engine, I have no problem with swapping all electrical and if needed cams ect.. long as the block and head is the same ?
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Artem Vestsorov 07-29-2014 20:45
Yeah, totally possible. Same block and head. Look at the comment from Brent Hoffman - he swapped in a fusion 2.3 into his Mazda 5. He said that he had to swap the cams, the oil pan, and a bunch of other stuff. Since you have a 2007 I don't think you will need need to do the cams (do check the teeth just in case) or the fuel rail. Oil pan will definitely have to be swapped though since the Mazda 5 oil pan has the A/C compressor under it. Crank pulley and sensor will have to be swapped. Oil pressure sensor too.
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Ken 07-29-2014 21:11
Ya I was thinking this Mazda 3 engine must be able to go into my Mazda 6, I am just confused by the whole VVT thing. I understand I HAVE to switch the cam cover over (due to different placed crank sensor), but if the VVT oil lines are different, what can I do then? I'll also assume I can keep the oil pan on because I can just relocate the AC pump to where it goes on the newer version.

Any help with timing cover and VVT guys?

Thanks again for everything.
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Neven 07-29-2014 23:30
Thanks man , I will try and have some fun:)
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Tav 07-31-2014 13:13
hello sir

thank you for a very helpful tutorial on the mazda 6. i have a few questions regarding engine swaps. firstly i want to buy a 2007 mazda 6 2.3l with an engine knock and i want to replace the engine with a 2.3l ford fusion one of the same year. are there any modifications or changes to things like covers and oil pans for example that need to be made or this will be just a simple straight swap?

secondly how reliable is this motor i see many reviews of knocks on this engine.

thank you i would appreciate any assistance you can lend me.

Tav
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Artem Vestsorov 07-31-2014 14:18
From the article - "Basically, if you have the newer 06-08 Mazda 6 with the coil-on-plug setup then swapping to a Fusion engine is a breeze - the parts that you have to reuse from your old engine are the crankshaft pulley, crank position sensor, and oil pressure sensor."

That's it. Everything else is the same.

The 2.3 is definitely not the most reliable engine around. Many owners with the Mazda 3, Mazda 5, Mazda 6 have reported knocking. Even the Ford 2.3s are not that much better. You will extend the life of the 2.3 if you check the oil level often, replace the oil regularly, and use good quality synthetic oil.
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Tav 07-31-2014 15:57
thank Artem i really appreciate the help. so i am guessing replacing the 2.3 with the v6 model would be bad idea and a headache in a can ryt?
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Artem Vestsorov 07-31-2014 20:18
Not worth it. Too much work and $$$ involved in replacing everything from the wiring harness down to the axles.
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Neven 08-10-2014 06:36
Hey guys, does anyone know exact measurements of AST tool FM 2300, for Mazda/Ford engine 2.3l, crankshaft locking peg...Reason being I made this tool in my machine shop now I have to cut it to size...

I found on other website size being 1" and 7/16 which would equal 36.5 mm from head to end ....

any help would be appreciated...
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Artem Vestsorov 08-10-2014 12:18
I don't have the AST tool, but the locking peg that I got from MassiveSpeedSys tem had an overall length of 1.9011 inches. Length of the head was .4029 inches. So that means the portion that went into the block was 1.4982 inches (38.0543 mm).
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Neven 08-10-2014 23:38
Thank you that is exactly what I need ....
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NS 08-11-2014 00:51
Hey guys before I tell you my experience with engine swap , I would like to thank you for all the help that I received here…also every question that I had was answered same day so thank you again ..


My experience ..

2007 Mazda 5 2.3l engine had a knock on cyl. #2
2007 Ford Fusion engine with low km was my replacement engine …..

My major concern was, if I can make this work, due to some reading I did here and else ware, I was confident that it can be done and it can ….

So I striped everything down from new Fusion engine

What do you need to swap from your old Mazda engine to Fusion engine . .
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NS 08-11-2014 00:52
Valve cover
Oil pan --- totally different A/c compressor is bolted on it.
Camshaft --- even if 2007 Fusion I was hoping that cams are the same but no, late o6 production on Mazda engine.
Timing cover --- exactly the same , but I took my anyways ,I had to get to chain tensioner to swap cams.
Crank shaft pulley---make yourself a locking tool or just buy it.
Crankshaft sensor ---- looks the same but..
Knock sensors ---- they look the same, but I did not want to take a chance , hard to get to it later
Fuel injectors---- connections are definitely same but Fusion ones were black in colour, my were green so I used my.
Oil cooler --- Fusion does not have one
Alternator ---well I wanted to use my but I discover that top bolt I have no place to put it, on my Mazda engine is on casing of the water pump ,which is part of the block and it is casted that way . …. So you can leave it with three bolts or just get Fusion alternator, which I did not get yet so I cannot tell you if the belt is going to be the same .if you leave it like I did, it looks ugly I have to admit ….
Pilot bearing--- My Mazda is manual and Fusion was automatic so you need one there.

I belive that is it ….so to clarify,,,,,eng ine runs in my car no problem, can it be done yes it can be , is it easy, depending on your skill, in my opinion not at all , but one thing is for sure its time consuming ..
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NS 08-11-2014 00:54
*Also head is identical but block is different due to top bolt on water pump, so technically internals are the same but
block is different….

Is it worth it….well its up to you but I will think twice before I do it again, resealing timing cover and oil pan ,also worrying about timing plus everything else took too much time,

If I just went and bought 2007 Mazda engine with 90 00km at local scrap yard, it would cost me $1280 tax in .

Fusion engine 59km $600 even
New intake many fold gasket $20
New exhaust many fold gasket $22
New valve cover $20
New oil cooler/filter gasket kit $29
New pilot bearing $10
Sealer/silicon for oil/timing cover $15
Used alternator $60

I put few days of work to swap everything and to make my own tools, I saved $400 , but I lost few more days so time equals money so you decide which one is more valuable to you.
Definitely fun project …..
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Artem Vestsorov 08-12-2014 09:37
Thanks for the details and the update. I'm sure it will be helpful to Mazda 5 owners.
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vladislav 09-01-2014 02:48
Hi my name is Vlad my mechanic friends and i just finished the engine swap from a 2004 Mazda 6 with a mercury Milan 2008 engine and we connected all the parts but forgot to change the intake camshaft wheel cog and we tried starting it up it goes and gives off a spark and a blow from the air flow but dose not go further and my mechanic friends said that maybe we have to reprogram the computer or scan it and see what it will do and ask a friend to check it so or would i have to take the engine out and replace the parts that i dident like the camshaft pulley and wheel cog ? please i am in need of help
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Artem Vestsorov 09-01-2014 21:49
You have to swap the intake camshaft, there is no way around that. I also don't recommend removing the wheel cog unless you have a way to reinstall it in the exact position that it was removed in.
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vlad 09-08-2014 22:00
hi its vlad again and my dads mechanic friend said that the intake camshaft you cant put it on the other engine and my dad said that it would be better if ford dealership would change the wheel cogs in the same position for 60$ and where did u find the timing peg i looked all over and only at napa but they ran out so i will have to order on and is this how its called right crankshaft tdc timing peg
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vladislav 09-08-2014 22:29
and does it matter if i buy a timing peg or pin
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Don 10-13-2014 12:31
I just finished installing a 2008 Fusion 2.3 in a 2008 Mazda3. My big problem is that the immobilizer is preventing the engine from even turning over. The car icon flashes very quickly for about a minute and then begins to flash code 16. That is a code for a communications error on the CAN bus between the PCM and the instrument cluster. I've checked all wiring connections and don't see a problem.

Any hints before I take the thing to a dealer and get soaked?
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nojodas67 10-14-2014 01:32
Quoting Don:
I just finished installing a 2008 Fusion 2.3 in a 2008 Mazda3. My big problem is that the immobilizer is preventing the engine from even turning over. The car icon flashes very quickly for about a minute and then begins to flash code 16. That is a code for a communications error on the CAN bus between the PCM and the instrument cluster. I've checked all wiring connections and don't see a problem.

Any hints before I take the thing to a dealer and get soaked?

In order to help you, I need more background on what you're doing, exactly what you've already done, how you did the swap, what wires you disconnected, etc.
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Don 10-14-2014 02:52
On the 2008 Fusion engine: I swapped out oil pan, crankshaft sensor, oil pressure sensor, crank pulley and coil packs.

I have the bar to time the cam and the pin to set the crankshaft in position. I made a locking bar that used the starter mount holes with a stub that engaged the flywheel teeth to lock the crankshaft when I broke the pulley bolt loose. When installing the pulley I used a new crankshaft pulley bolt and put a 6 mm bolt thru the pulley to engage the tapped hole in the cover. Torqued to 75 ft-lbs and then 90 degrees. Removed locks and timing tools, rotated engine a couple of turns and reinstalled timing tools to verify timing.

I used Fusion injectors and cam position sensor. I used the Mazda injector harness. I installed the Mazda alternator with 3 bolts. I used the Fusion intake manifold and throttle body.

I had one issue when I was connecting the harness to the PCM. I had the routing for the front connector harness wrong and it was hard to get enough cable slack to plug it in the PCM. I got it to connect though and thought it had fully seated.With everything together I tried to start it and got no crank.

Continued..
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nojodas67 10-14-2014 13:20
Quoting Don:
On the 2008 Fusion engine: I swapped out oil pan, crankshaft sensor, oil pressure sensor, crank pulley and coil packs.

I have the bar to time the cam and the pin to set the crankshaft in position. I made a locking bar that used the starter mount holes with a stub that engaged the flywheel teeth to lock the crankshaft when I broke the pulley bolt loose. When installing the pulley I used a new crankshaft pulley bolt and put a 6 mm bolt thru the pulley to engage the tapped hole in the cover. Torqued to 75 ft-lbs and then 90 degrees. Removed locks and timing tools, rotated engine a couple of turns and reinstalled timing tools to verify timing.

I used Fusion injectors and cam position sensor. I used the Mazda injector harness. I installed the Mazda alternator with 3 bolts. I used the Fusion intake manifold and throttle body.

I had one issue when I was connecting the harness to the PCM. I had the routing for the front connector harness wrong and it was hard to get enough cable slack to plug it in the PCM. I got it to connect though and thought it had fully seated.With everything together I tried to start it and got no crank.

Continued..

I do know that you CANNOT USE the Fusion throttle body. Disconnect the battery, put the Mazda throttle body back on the intake manifold, reconnect throttle body connector, reconnect battery and try to start. Then report back.
(continued)
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Don 10-14-2014 02:54
Key light flashes rapidly and then settles down to a 1 - 6 pattern. At this point I stopped and took the air box, battery, PCM back out and checked to make sure every single wiring connection was connected. Between the harness having unique plugs and wire lengths I'm pretty sure the harness is connected properly. I verified I had reconnected ground wires at the bracket on the engine corner at O2 connections, at the starter, and at the bracket on top of the transmission. I don't see any unconnected wires. Rerouted the front PCM connector to get more slack and reassembled. Same no start immobilizer error.

I pulled all fuses under the hood and checked them with an ohm meter. All good. Pulled all fuses in the passenger fuse box. All are good.

Replaced the battery just to rule that out. Still no start. Tried both keys (those worked 2 weeks ago) and could not start with either key.

I have taken off the starter solenoid coil wire and run a wire from the battery + to the solenoid small terminal. When that makes contact the engine will crank so the starter works and the engine is not locked up.

Web searches suggested I verify that the "A" connector (O/Y) wire at the OBD port has 12 volts. It does.


What can I check?
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Don 10-14-2014 13:02
What pins on the PCM's should I check for 12 volt power?

What pins should I check for ground?

What pins are the CAN connections?

I suspect the PCM is dead
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nojodas67 10-14-2014 13:21
(con't)
If the immobilizer is still triggered, I don't know why you disconnected the PCM in the first place. You may accidentally have erased the immobilizer memory by disconnecting it and removing every fuse; if the key icon still flashes rapidly, it does not recognize the transponder in the key and the PCM will have to be reprogrammed, but the dealer isn't the only one that can do that. Any capable locksmith will be able to program the keys again to the PCM. Around here, my local locksmith charges $80 to program 2 keys to a Mazda. The PCM is not dead, just needs to be mated to the keys again.
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Don 10-14-2014 14:36
1. Changed Throttle body. No Change

2. I'm confused about disconnecting PCM. I think the PCM is the electronics box on the side of the battery box. Battery box has to come out to reach bolts. I disconnected the two electrical connectors to the PCM after the battery was removed and then removed PCM with the battery box. How else should I have done that?

3. I started pulling fuses to check them AFTER I had the immobilizer problem. Battery was disconnected when I pulled and checked them. Why would that erase the immobilzer memory?
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nojodas67 10-14-2014 14:45
I know that the engine will not run without the original throttle body (I've done that a couple of times), but it should at least crank with the key. Somehow, the immobilizer memory was reset or lost. I've done over a dozen swaps but only on Mazda6's, Mazda5's and Tribute/Escape vehicles, not a Mazda3 yet; in those other vehicles, the PCM does not have to be disconnected, just the ABS pump connector located by the pass fender.
If you have in fact verified all electrical connectors and don't have any lose ground leads, the only thing to do is to call a locksmith and reprogram the keys.
With the correct throttle body, once the key is programmed, it should start.
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Don 10-15-2014 22:23
No start is fixed. Code 16 of the immobilizer cleared. It really did mean that the CAN circuits had a problem. I've spent hours tracing circuits. This site in particular got me on the right path.

http://www.automotivetroubleshootingsecrets.com/2004%20Mazda%20Bus%20wiring%20network.html

I traced the continuity of the can wires from the engine harness to the fuse box. And. from the fuse box to the OBD connector. My problem was that the engine harness would NOT make clean contact with the fuse box. Clean, align pins, clean, dremel a piece of plastic that seemed to be holding the connector up, etc,

All of a sudden the immobilizer cleared and the car started. Whew..

Thanks for this article. Thanks Nojodas67.

I spent $345 on a Fusion engine whereas the yards in my area wanted $1500 to $2000 for a Mazda3 engine.
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nojodas67 10-15-2014 22:39
BTW: just for kicks, put the Fusion throttle body on it and you'll see that it will crank, but it won't run.
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nojodas67 10-15-2014 22:37
Congratulations ! I'm glad you got it sorted out. And thanks for sharing how you traced and fixed the problem, so that others in the future can benefit from your experience.
Probably by trying to stretch the harness (you mentioned you had to re-route it to gain some slack), it caused one or more of the connector pins to get bent and not make contact.
It reminded me when I did a transmission swap a few months back on a Ford van that had a similar issue. After swapping the transmission out and taking it for a test drive, it would only stay in 1st gear and would not shift up at all. So I was about to take the trans out again and was feeling very bummed out about doing the job again, even though the yard was going to exchange it under warranty. But when I disconnected the electrical connector I noticed that one of the pins was bent, I straightened out the pin, plugged it back in and problem fixed!
Anyway, good luck with your car.
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Don 10-15-2014 23:14
Here is another site that came in handy. PCM pinouts
http://hackedecu.com/mazda-3-2004-2008-ecu-pinouts
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vlad 10-17-2014 16:16
hey my Mazda started and all thanks for the help and there is steam coming from the tube coming out of the antifreeze tank and there is a leakage of some sort of liquid down by the battery idk why but can anyone help and there is a check engine code p2187 system to lean at idle idk exactly but it might be the o2 sensor on the exhaust can anyone help
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Lauren 10-25-2014 20:06
Asking for clarification here - I bought a 2005 Mazda 3 2.3l Turbo - It seems like the previous owner swapped the engine, and it' a ford fusion engine.

The question I have .. Do I need to purchsae Mazda 3 Camshaft and replace it with Ford Fusion CamShaft?

Or Do I just need to purchase intake camshaft wheeling unit (Mazda's) to replace the wheeling part.

Thx
Lauren
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Artem Vestsorov 10-25-2014 22:25
Are you talking about the Mazdaspeed 3 or a regular Mazda 3 that has a turbo system? Fusion engine won't work in a Mazdaspeed. Next question is why are you looking to replace the camshaft - does the engine still have the Fusion camshaft? You cannot buy just the timing cog. Only way to get the timing cog is to remove it from an exisiting camshaft.
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Tim 10-29-2014 18:29
I have read this whole article, and found a lot of useful and success stories , now i am going to order a fusion motor , but would like to get just a little clarity , what i have is a 2006 Mazda 3 with the California emissions , is that making a difference to any thing i have been reading in this forum , thanks for the help
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nojodas67 11-29-2014 17:02
Emission version will not make a difference on the swap, as long as you retain the original exhaust system and pcm of the car.
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Ken 11-30-2014 05:07
Ok guys, can someone PLEASE help me. I am just about 1/2 way done doing this swap now and have a few questions. My car is a 2006 Mazda 6 and I got a 2.3 out of a 2008 Fusion. Everything seems to be going smoothly, except I notice this new engine has a VCT plug on the top of the valve cover and my old one just has a plug in that whole. What do I do with this new VCT plug? Do I just leave it there with nothing plugged into it? Will it effect the way the engine runs? Any help would be great. Thanks
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nojodas67 12-07-2014 02:04
Quoting Ken:
Ok guys, can someone PLEASE help me. I am just about 1/2 way done doing this swap now and have a few questions. My car is a 2006 Mazda 6 and I got a 2.3 out of a 2008 Fusion. Everything seems to be going smoothly, except I notice this new engine has a VCT plug on the top of the valve cover and my old one just has a plug in that whole. What do I do with this new VCT plug? Do I just leave it there with nothing plugged into it? Will it effect the way the engine runs? Any help would be great. Thanks

What plug? Is it on the top of the head between the two middle spark plugs or on top of the plastic valve cover at the front of the engine?
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Ken 12-07-2014 03:15
Thanks for your reply Nojodas67. It is the plug in the middle of the valve cover (not the one at the end of cover). My old Mazda motor never had it, but this 2008 Fusion engine has it. If I remove the valve cover, this plug is for a long cylinder-like thing that screws directly into the head. If I was to take a guess, I would say its for the VCT solenoid.

All this being said, I have the engine in now and have put on over 1000 kms so far and it runs VERY well. I had to switch over crank pulley, crank sensor, intake and throttle body, and I even changed the oil pressure sensor even though it looked 100% identical to the one already on.
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nojodas67 12-07-2014 17:17
That is just another temperature sensor in the Fusion cars, it measures the head temperature (not coolant temp). It's not necessary in the Mazda. You can just unscrew and remove it, the threaded hole does NOT go through any coolant or oil passages.
Glad to hear you got it running ok. Be sure to use only synthetic oil and change it every 3-5k miles (depending on your daily commute). When it's time to replace the timing chain, you need to buy parts for a Fusion (not Mazda); all the timing components (chains, gears, tensioner, etc.) are different.
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nojodas67 12-07-2014 17:19
I mentioned that you can remove that temp sensor so that you'll be able to install your original Mazda valve cover (without that center hole), if you wish to do that. Otherwise, you can leave it as is.
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freddie ravan 12-05-2014 18:18
can I change my 07 escape from 2.3 to 3.0 v6
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nojodas67 12-07-2014 02:06
You'd be the first to try, so let us know how it goes. However, I don't know why you would want to do it, seems like A LOT of work and not much gain in power. Your fuel consumption will be much higher though.
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charles york 12-18-2014 02:31
Hello I am going to do a swap on my 2004 mazda 3 2.3 and put a ford 2.3 fusion motor I need to know what ford vin matches my mazda vin my 8th vin num is 3 . Thank you and I need to know what year is compatible with my 2004 mazda 3 .
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nojodas67 12-18-2014 02:53
Your questions have already been answered in great detail, read the guide from the beginning, AND the "FAQ" section above.
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Jim Nelson 12-18-2014 18:38
The 2010-2013 Ford 2.5L also looks like the same engine. Has anyone tried to do this swap vs the 2.3L? Any recommendations ?
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nojodas67 12-18-2014 19:30
Apparently you missed it.
Read page 1 of the comments, about the third one down from the top. Written on 9/28 by Thomas.
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Artem Vestsorov 12-18-2014 21:49
I'll say one more thing about the 2.5 swap - technically yes it can be done. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but everything that I have read states that the 2.5 cylinder head has larger intake ports and a different intake manifold. So, if you use your Mazda intake manifold, you'll get a slight air leak because the manifold won't seal correctly with the larger ports. Or, if you use the Fusion intake manifold you will set off the check engine light.
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Bob 12-26-2014 17:31
I am wondering the same thing that Artem is about the possible intake leak issue. For a full explanation, please see my post at http://www.mazda3forums.com/showthread.php?p=9669289#post9669289

Thanks
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nojodas67 12-27-2014 00:20
The intake ports being taller is not a big deal, just purchase the 2.5L intake gasket or make your own, like I did.
I purchased a 2008 Kia Rondo with a knocking 2.4L Kia engine. I looked and looked for a used Kia engine but the lowest price I could find for a used engine was $1,800 and internal part prices to rebuild the Kia were just as ridiculously priced; so I started looking for alternatives. After lots of searching and lengthy comparisons at various engines from different brands, both online and in local yards, I thought that I could use a Dodge 2.4L "world" engine (found in Dodge Avenger, Sebring, etc) for this swap; since the Dodge engine was only $300 I figured it was worth the try. After I got both engines side by side and swapped some parts and accessories from the knocking Kia engine to the used Dodge engine, I too noticed that the intake ports in the Dodge head were taller, so I just made my own intake gaskets slightly larger than the intake manifold ports, glued them in place with silicone and put it back together and fired it up; No intake leaks!
Have not tried it on the Ford 2.5L but I bet it's a similar solution.
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nojodas67 12-27-2014 00:21
Lately though, I've been rebuilding wrecked late model cars that I've purchased from insurance companies, rather than doing Mazda engine swaps. The former is much easier than engine swaps and much more rewarding ($$$$). For example, I just fixed and sold a 2013 Escape, a 2014 GMC Terrain, two 2013 Chevy Equinox LTZ's and I'm currently working on a 2014 Mazda3 GT Skyactiv with just 3,400 miles; all in just the past 3 months.
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Bob 12-27-2014 02:45
Quoting nojodas67:
Lately though, I've been rebuilding wrecked late model cars that I've purchased from insurance companies, rather than doing Mazda engine swaps. The former is much easier than engine swaps and much more rewarding ($$$$). For example, I just fixed and sold a 2013 Escape, a 2014 GMC Terrain, two 2013 Chevy Equinox LTZ's and I'm currently working on a 2014 Mazda3 GT Skyactiv with just 3,400 miles; all in just the past 3 months.


Man I was hoping you were still monitoring this thread - you're my hero in this Ford to Mazda engine swapping business! This afternoon I put a little used motor oil on the rubber intake gaskets (they look more like an o-ring than a gasket) with a q-tip and then test fitted the manifold to the head. I can definitely see why people are having problems with leaks. It looked like the oil imprint was right on the top edge of the intake port in the head, like 1/2 of the rubber gasket might contact the sealing surface on the head, but the other half wouldn't touch and would be down into the port in the head. I'm doing a little experimenting now to see if I can nudge the intake up just a fraction of an inch in order to get the rubber intake gasket up on the head sealing surface and I believe it's going to work.
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nojodas67 12-27-2014 06:53
Rather than repositioning the intake manifold, I would try to make my own gasket, instead of using the o-rings. You can buy a sheet (8.5"x11") of gasket material at Autozone for about $6. If you do it right, and use some silicone sealer, it should work just fine, like I did in the Kia swap.
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Bob 12-27-2014 02:56
Quoting nojodas67:
Lately though, I've been rebuilding wrecked late model cars that I've purchased from insurance companies, rather than doing Mazda engine swaps. The former is much easier than engine swaps and much more rewarding ($$$$). For example, I just fixed and sold a 2013 Escape, a 2014 GMC Terrain, two 2013 Chevy Equinox LTZ's and I'm currently working on a 2014 Mazda3 GT Skyactiv with just 3,400 miles; all in just the past 3 months.


I saw how many of these swaps you had done and you inspired me try my hand at it too. I work for the government in western Washington State but am thinking about retiring and will need something to do in retirement. Making a few bucks would be nice also.

It looks like you've come up with another money maker. How do you go about buying the wrecked cars from the insurance companies, if you don't mind me asking? Also, are you doing paint and bodywork or just R&R parts? I grew up on a farm/ranch and have been doing mechanic work my whole life, but not bodywork. I fixed the dents on a '66 El Camino when I was young and in the end the body looked like a bag of walnuts! I would love to get in on this unless it involves paint and real bodywork.

Thanks for your reply.
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nojodas67 12-27-2014 07:22
I don't wish to sabotage this page by going off-topic, so I'll answer your question briefly. Artem, feel free to delete my post once Bob has read it.
I don't do the bodywork or painting myself; however, I have a friend that owns a body shop that's only about a mile from my house, he lets me dismantle the cars at his shop and get it ready for body work and paint, I source all the parts needed, then once the bodywork and painting is done by his employees, he puts it aside in a spare stall, then I come in and let's me put it back together. Once the car is drivable, then I bring it to my house and finish the rest. It ends up being very reasonable for me to do the cars that way. On a couple of cars, he's let me do the minor straightening and pulling with his drive-on cheetah machine ( http://www.staraliner.com/cheeta55.htm).
To purchase these cars, you must know someone at an insurance company auto-dispositio n department, or you could buy them through many insurance auto auctions around the country, or through many repairable-auto dealers in your area, such as Foster Auto, just to name one of these dealers. (http://www.fosterauto.com/view_vehicle.html?vehicle_id=MjQyNQ==)
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Bob 12-27-2014 07:31
Got it, sounds like a sweet deal you have going there. Thanks and sorry for sidetracking the thread - please delete.
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nojodas67 12-27-2014 07:42
I am very selective about the cars I buy; the damage is usually minor. The 2013 Escape SEL for instance was a fully loaded model with very low miles. It had sustained a side impact to both left doors. I knew it would be difficult to find used parts for this car since Escapes had undergone a model change for the 2013 model year so there weren't very many donor cars to buy parts from at salvage yards. So prior to purchasing this car, I looked around and I was able to find two used left doors, and rear quarter panel from a donor car with the same exact color code; so once I knew that I had found all the parts I needed, I purchased the car and purchased the parts the same day. The doors were just bolt-on, the body shop replaced the rear quarter and did the final alignment of the doors. I like to use salvage parts because the repaired car then has the same good panel fit and quality of an unmolested car; since it's basically the same car, but with some parts from another car further down in the assembly line. Most body shops are mandated by insurance companies to use cheap Chinese body replacement parts that don't fit well and are usually of inferior quality than OEM. And in the case of the Escape I repaired, it even has the original factory paint in the doors and quarter panel. The only part that was painted was the seam area of the rear fender, where it was spot welded by the shop.
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Bob 12-28-2014 05:12
Sounds like fun AND you're making money - I'm jealous.
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victor 12-29-2014 01:16
you guys who have swapped engines i need one mazda 6 2.3 lit crank shaft and one rod bearing cap who can contribute one?()
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nojodas67 12-29-2014 05:35
I have a couple of connecting rods (with caps) that I've removed from old engines, I can give you one set. But the engines that I've swapped all had bad rod knocks so the crankshafts are bad and will need to be reconditioned. Last time I checked you can buy new crankshafts for about $300 on Ebay, a little more than the cost of reconditioning a badly scratched used crank and rod journals, plus oversize bearings. (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-2-3L-Duratec-Crankshaft-Fits-Mazda-and-Ford-/321523077873?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4adc44d2f1&vxp=mtr).
But if you are building a racer and want piece of mind, there is a seller on Ebay selling Keyed (you read it correctly, keyed) crankshafts for these flawed non-keyed Duratec 2.3L engines. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Keyed-Crank-Crankshaft-Timing-Chain-Drive-Duratec-Focus-Fusion-Ranger-Light-2-3-/261486712981?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&fits=Make%3AMazda|Engine+-+Liter_Display%3A2.3L&hash=item3ce1d29895&vxp=mtr

But if you still want a bad crankshaft, just pay for the shipping and I will send you one, along with a connecting rod & cap.
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Scott 12-30-2014 16:37
I have been reading this tread because I have had the engine swapped in my 2005 Ford Escape by a garage an hour and half away from me because I could not find an engine closer to me. When I got it back I noticed that the dipstick was now located in the valve cover instead of separate from the block. Also, it had square Coils instead of the round Coils. The other thing that I noticed was that there was an electrical socket in the valve cover on the timing chain end of the engine that was not connected to anything. After some research and thanks to this thread, I have learned that this is the VVT electrical connection. The original engine did not have VVT, so the harness and the computer would not be setup to power the VVT.

The engine seems to run okay, but is it okay to run it without the VVT connected? Am I loosing any performance by not having it connected?
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nojodas67 12-30-2014 20:23
Yes, while you are not getting peak performance out of this engine, that escape never had vvt originally anyhow; nontheless, you're not losing any horsepower either.
You probably paid too much for that engine though, non-vvt motors are normally less expensive. Instead of searching for an Escape motor, You could have bought a 2.3l Focus engine for less and they are much easier to find than salvaged 2.3l Escapes. I know all yards will tell you that a focus engine will not work in an escape, but they are identical. I've even swapped in 2.0l Focus engines in 2 escapes and I did not notice any significant power difference, and both Escapes ran great.
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Scott 12-30-2014 20:59
Thank you. I did not realize that they were putting in an engine with VVT. They were told that we needed a 2.3l engine for an Escape with 8 VIN of Z.

They would not sell the 2.3l engine outright. They would only sell it if they installed the engine because of the special procedures these engines require.

I paid $1700 for the engine and installation. I figured that was good since a dealer quoted $1200 just to put a timing chain in the engine that was in the car. Also, all the engine I found on E-bay were $1300 and up.

Thanks again.
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justduit2 01-03-2015 06:37
I just completed swapping a 2006 Fusion engine into a 2008 Mazda 5 and thought I would share my experience. Many thanks to Artem and nojodas67 and everyone else for all the info available on this page.

Things I had to swap:
Crankshaft Pulley- 5 uses 2 belts, Fusion 1, also different sensor wheel
Oil pan and oil pickup- 5 oil pan has mounting for AC compressor, 5 pan is deeper requiring the pickup from the 5 engine
Oil filter housing- 5 has cooling plumbed to top, Fusion does not
Oil Control Valve- connector was different
Flex plate- have not seen this mentioned, but the Fusion one went a good 1/4" deeper into the bell housing
Valve cover- didn't have to, but didn't want the extra hole from the Fusion cover

I also swapped intake manifold and throttle body, pcv valve and oil splitter, and timing cover. None of these were mechanically necessary, but were in better condition on 5. VVT actuator on Fusion engine was bad, so I used the 5 actuator and the Fusion timing gear. (continued)
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justduit2 01-03-2015 07:03
I pulled the engine out the top with a lift, but not the transmission. Removing the wipers and cowl made more room to maneuver. I had to remove the crank pulley before lifting the engine out to have space to seperate the engine and transmission.

The torque converter pulled out of the transmission as I swung the engine over, had to use a pry bar to separate the flex plate and tc. I also had difficulty keeping the tc seated when putting the new engine in. Had everything lined up, tightened up the bell housing bolts and could not turn the engine. Loosened the bolts and was able to turn the engine again. Pulled the engine back out, made certain I got 2 clunks when seating tc, was very careful to keep tc seated while positioning and bolting in engine, tightened bolts slowly and evenly around the bell housing, and was able to turn engine when all bolts were tight.

I ran into an issue with the Fusion engine. When I pulled the valve cover to check timing I found oil sludge. As deep as the 2nd knuckle on my index finger in some areas. It took a lot of time and 20 cans of carb cleaner to clean the sludge out of the engine. It would probably have been more time efficient to have repaired the 5 engine than clean the sludge from the Fusion engine. (continued)
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nojodas67 01-04-2015 04:24
Quoting justduit2:

I ran into an issue with the Fusion engine. When I pulled the valve cover to check timing I found oil sludge. As deep as the 2nd knuckle on my index finger in some areas. It took a lot of time and 20 cans of carb cleaner to clean the sludge out of the engine. It would probably have been more time efficient to have repaired the 5 engine than clean the sludge from the Fusion engine. (continued)

When I look at a used engine for purchase from any yard, I always pull the oil pan to check rod clearance on all rod bearings, then I pull the valve cover to check for timing chain play and sludge. It has saved me from doing possible extra work, like what you had to do, after the engine is installed; and saved me from doing the job twice a few times too, when the engines I was about to buy turned out to be bad.
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justduit2 01-03-2015 07:09
The new engine fired right up, idled nicely, and drove exactly like the old engine. I idled the new engine for about 30 minutes, drained the oil and changed the filter in hopes of catching any sludge floating around in the oil. The filter did pick up a few chunks of sludge, and also some metal flakes that I'm assuming came from the oil filter housing. I saw no flakes in the engine as I was cleaning it, and all the rods are tight. I put in a quart of marvel mystery oil when I refilled the oil and plan on changing the oil and filter again in about 500 miles.
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nojodas67 01-04-2015 04:31
Quoting justduit2:
I put in a quart of marvel mystery oil when I refilled the oil and plan on changing the oil and filter again in about 500 miles.
That's good. A quart of transmission fluid works great too, and you can leave it in until next oil change.
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justduit2 01-03-2015 17:35
A few more things I forgot to mention. Put in a new thermostat, the hose connections are slightly different. Fusion thermostat would probably have worked OK but I put a new one on since I had the engine out.

I had to install the alternator using 3 bolts instead of 4 as has been mentioned previously.

Mark
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nojodas67 01-04-2015 04:16
Congratulations on a job well done and thanks for taking the time to write about your swap.
When I did a swap on a couple of Mazda 5's, ( as I had explained here on previous posts) I first removed the front bumper cover and bumper bar. Then I removed the core support/radiato r/fan assembly all together as a unit. When all that's out of the way (which takes only 15 minutes), it is MUCH MUCH easier to pull the engine out and put the new one back in. I then removed the transmission mounts and slid the transmission (with half-shafts still attached) a few inches towards the driver side, and support it to the side frame rail of the car. This gives you all the clearance you need to remove the engine complete! The engine comes out directly out towards the front of the car (NOT through the top, so there are no clearance issues with the cowl, firewall, shock towers, etc. There is no need to remove the crank pulley nor any of the other pulleys, nor any accessories nor intake or exhaust manifolds. So the engine comes out (and goes in) with all accessories, serpentine belt, alternator, intake and exhaust manifolds, etc. attached. The extra clearance also makes it very easy to separate (and later marriage) the engine to the transmission. I cannot stress enough, that it's much easier to do it this way.
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justduit2 01-04-2015 22:27
This was my 1st time ever doing anything like this before, and the guy helping me has done several engine swaps and rebuilds. He suggested pulling it out the top and leaving the transmission alone. I wish I had done it your way, probably would have avoided the torque converter difficulties. Pulling the wipers and cowl is easy, 5 or 10 minutes. I would pull it again simply for the space removing it provides.
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justduit2 01-04-2015 22:36
I unbolted the exhaust manifold and left it in the car. Pulling the manifold studs out kept it from interfering when pulling the engine out and putting it in. I zip tied the manifold back to keep it out of the way.
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victor 01-04-2015 07:33
I need crank shaft and one rod bearing cap off tour core mazda6 engine can any body help? My Mazda crank has a gear between 2nd and 3rd cyl. Does focus crank have that gear also? Reply to
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nojodas67 01-04-2015 21:18
I already answered you and offered what I have, did you miss my post. Here it is again:

"I have a couple of connecting rods (with caps) that I've removed from old engines, I can give you one set. But the engines that I've swapped all had bad rod knocks so the crankshafts are bad and will need to be reconditioned. Last time I checked you can buy new crankshafts for about $300 on Ebay, a little more than the cost of reconditioning a badly scratched used crank and rod journals, plus oversize bearings. (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-2-3L-Duratec-Crankshaft-Fits-Mazda-and-Ford-/321523077873?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4adc44d2f1&vxp=mtr).
But if you are building a racer and want piece of mind, there is a seller on Ebay selling Keyed (you read it correctly, keyed) crankshafts for these flawed non-keyed Duratec 2.3L engines. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Keyed-Crank-Crankshaft-Timing-Chain-Drive-Duratec-Focus-Fusion-Ranger-Light-2-3-/261486712981?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&fits=Make%3AMazda|Engine+-+Liter_Display%3A2.3L&hash=item3ce1d29895&vxp=mtr

But if you still want a bad crankshaft, just pay for the shipping and I will send you one, along with a connecting rod & cap. - See more at: http://www.happywrenching.com/mazda/6/mazda-6-and-ford-fusion-23l-engine-swap.html#sthash.1uy8jbzc.dpuf"
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victor 01-05-2015 06:06
Nojodas67 thank u 4 yr answer the story is that my 4th rod jurnal has cracks and was noisy and had about .5 mm slack i arec welded 5 spots on the side of rod cap and solved the slack problem and noise qent away 4 about 30 miles then came back but very little (thats why i need one cap only)i do not want to change the engine i want to change crank and that one cap only .machine shop says if crank has cracks it can bot be ground thats why i need a regrindable crank. 1-what is yr idea? 2-i am in chino hills ca where are u?3-how much is shipping and how i pay u?4-tell me any thing that comes to yr mund 5-is yr crank grindable? 6-does yr cranh have a gear bet 2nd and 3rd syl?7-what is this stupid gear for (it is geared to some stupid syl and pistones.
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justduit2 01-05-2015 10:20
Quoting victor:
7-what is this stupid gear for (it is geared to some stupid syl and pistones.

That gear is to turn the balance shafts. You would have had to remove the balance shaft assembly to remove the crank, it mounts beneath it with 4 bolts. Of it wasn't there, some previous owner deleted it which requires plugging the oil passage to the balance shafts, and to be done properly also need a full windage tray to replace the shafts.
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victor 01-05-2015 18:46
Thanks but Full windage tray? I do not get it
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nojodas67 01-05-2015 14:15
that's what I was trying to explain to you. If your crank is bad, rather than regrind it, you're better off just getting a new one, cost will be very close and you'll have a better engine with a new crank and new bearings. It does not have to have that gear (it drives the balance shafts). The vibration on an engine with balance-shaft-d elete is not really that noticeable. Then you can eliminate the balance shafts, and balance chain; but like "justduit2" mentioned, you have to plug the oil passages to the balance shaft assembly. Also, you cannot just replace a rod cap by itself, you have to replace each connecting rod and cap together, Ford uses "fracture" rods in these crappy engines, to shave manufacturing costs. (http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs00170-003-2022-2#page-1).
If you still want me to send you my core crank and a connecting rod/cap, I think shipping will be around $75 (it's heavy), I'm in the Chicago area.
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victor 01-05-2015 18:54
Thank u for your reply since i do not want to get into unforeseeable problem getting new crank could be better .so i will let u know. In this case i have to grind cap down to original thickness.
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Charles 01-05-2015 19:02
Will a 07 2 .3 ford fusion block work on my 04 mazda 3 2.3 sorry if it is a dumb question just don't wanna waste my money and this will b the first time I have ever done anything like this
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victor 01-06-2015 02:15
Dear Nojodas67 you made me spen all day learning about fracture splitting and my conclusion is that my mazda is not F splitted because the mating surface bet rod and cap must look rough but mine is machined and shiny (as i remember) please check yours and let me know .on my part i learned alot by the gints u gave me.
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nojodas67 01-06-2015 03:24
Victor: All Mazda and Ford L-series engines from 1.8liter to 2.5liter (introduced in 2001) have fracture-split connecting rods. It may be that the rods in your engine are not original or may have been reworked already. Either way, in your case, I would still get a new crank, and at least one new rod/cap assembly, and replace all the bearings while you're in there.
BTW: It's been very cold in my area (in negative territory for the next few days) and I'm not feeling very motivated to go in the garage and tear down one of my cores, but I do remember from the last time I had one of these engines apart, that the mating surfaces on these rods are not very rough anyway. The way they are split does not leave a very rough surface on these.
Anyway: If you liked reading the info about fracture splitting, here's an interesting wiki page about the Mazda/Ford 4 cyl. engine itself: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mazda_L_engine
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victor 01-06-2015 05:29
Thanks a lot do not want to bother u still i want to know if it is ok to put the ballancer on but use ford crank (gearless) or how can i block oil passage safely without worrying.
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nojodas67 01-06-2015 14:41
You can purchase a delete kit: http://www.jamesbaroneracing.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=434

Then follow this thread on how to do it: http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/showthread.php?123759678-HOW-TO-Balance-Shaft-delete
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victor 01-06-2015 19:14
Thank you all i can go ahead with more confidence now + i will post the result when done.
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lemon 01-09-2015 22:09
Hi,

I'm curious about doing the 2.5L swap like Thomas did, does anyone know if there would be an ECU issue with this? Is it really just the same as swapping the 2.3 components-wise ? I can get a much better mileage engine for roughly the same price going for the 2.5 coming out of a Tribute, and apparently it's a more reliable engine. I'd rather just get rid of the nightmare if I can. ;)

thanks
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nojodas67 01-09-2015 22:31
You didn't say what model car you have. So I'm assuming you have a Mazda3 or Mazda6, Either way, I think Tributes have non-vvt engines. You need a vvt engine out of a Fusion or Milan.
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nojodas67 01-09-2015 22:33
Escape, Focus, Tribute engines are more reliable because they have non-vvt engines. Vvt's are the weak points in these Ford 4-bangers.
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lemon 01-09-2015 22:51
Sorry, it's a Mazda 5, 2006. Same 2.3L as Mazda 3 and 6. I was curious about Thomas' comment that he followed "this guide" to do a 2.5 swap... I wasn't sure if that was a typo, or whether he meant THIS guide, or just some other guide, out there somewhere. Haha thanks anyway
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nojodas67 01-10-2015 01:04
I'm pretty sure he meant "this guide". Although I have not done a 2.5L swap yet, I don't see why they would be any different. I just thoroughly inspected a 2.5L motor, and from what I can see and read, it's identical to the 2.3L, the only difference is the stroke and bore. The ECU in your Mazda5 will not be able to tell the difference in the two engines, but you sure will as you take off from a stop... :)
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lemon 01-10-2015 04:59
Ok, so what you're saying is there are vvt 2.5L's in more recent fusions and milans? The Tribute engine I was looking at was online and it had a bracket in the title saying "fits 2.3L Fusion". But, it may be an error or there's just more to it I guess. Haven't turned up any info yet but haven't really had time to look yet either. I will poke around for the vvt equivalent in the meantime. Cheers
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Charles York 01-14-2015 22:55
Hello I just recently threw a rod in my 2004 Mazda 3 2.3 i was wondering if i bought a 06 ford fusion block if i could use the block to replace my blown block in my car. I also need a oil pan and basically the whole bottom Half of the motor. I have already taken the motor out of my car and am wondering if any of u guys could give some advice on what the cheapest route to take would b dont have alot of money off hand but like i said did manage to fine 06 2.3 fusion block for 350$
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nojodas67 01-15-2015 02:33
Your Mazda head will not work on the Fusion block, oil passages are different. You can buy a Fusion engine (complete or longblock) and do the swap per instructions in this guide. That would be the simplest and most cost effective way of fixing your car. Is your oil pan damaged beyond repair. Any good welder should be able to fix any cracks or small holes in your Mazda oil pan, unless it's beat up pretty back from a rod going through it.
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Charles York 01-15-2015 12:47
I am not totally sure it has on probley 3 in diameter hole and 2 cracks
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victor 01-15-2015 20:13
i plan to remove my 07 mazda's ballance shaft tomorrow (Friday). can a you guys tell me the pros and cons of doing this?
i was very much decided to do it for sure until i read that my engine may get some rattles which i am very sensitive of.
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nojodas67 01-17-2015 00:09
I have read many posts where people have removed the balance shafts on their 2.3L Duratec engines. Most have said that they did not notice considerable vibration, but a few people did say they noticed a little more vibration. I don't know what you mean by rattles. If your dash, or door panels etc rattle afterwards, then you need to address those issues, not the engine itself.
I have greatly diminished engine vibration on many cars by replacing the motor mounts, usually the main cause of engine vibrations.

Also after replacing at least one motor mount, or after an engine swap, I always support the weight of the engine/trans assembly with an engine hoist, loosen all the motor mounts a bit, start the engine and while holding the brake pedal, shift between drive, neutral and reverse a few times and at various engine speeds; then back to park, tighten all the mounts again and remove the engine hoist. This is to make sure there is no undue stress or torsion on any of the motor mounts as a result of engine, transmission or motor mount installation.

If you are particularly sensitive to vibrations, then you should probably not remove the balance shafts. But if the balance shafts are not properly timed, then you'll have more vibrations than if the shafts were removed.
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Charles 01-16-2015 23:08
Sorry for all the questions but can I put a 2.5 2010 fusion motor in my 04 2.3 mazda 3 and if I can what vin do I have to have I'm it's somewhere in the post but I can't find it and if I can't what vin does the 2.3 have to be
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nojodas67 01-17-2015 00:24
I have personally NOT installed a Duratec 2.5L into a Mazda6 or Mazda3, I've only done many 2.3L swaps. But I have read several posts where 2.5L swap have been done, perhaps someone else can chime in.
As far as engine VIN (8th digit); I would never rely on engine vin alone to make sure I purchase the correct engine, what if the donor car has had an engine swap (or two :)) You have to visually inspect and compare. Any 2.3L engine from a Fusion, Milan (or other models) will work on your Mazda3, but you have to make sure the replacement engine is equipped with VVT. This is easily recognized by verifying the existence of the VVT solenoid on top of the cyl. head.
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Thunder06 01-24-2015 18:14
Hey nojodas67 are you still active on this site, I could really use some advice.
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Thunder06 01-24-2015 17:48
Hey can someone help me, my daughter in law blew her motor up in a 2003 Mazda 6, she took it to a shop and dropped it off. The car set for about 6 months with the shop saying they could not find a matching motor to swap out. I took the car to another shop and they found a 2003 Mazda 6 motor with 39,000 miles on it. I bought the motor, they put it in and now it will not fire at all. They have put it on the computer and only get minimal readings on it. One being no power to TCM. Can anyone point me in a good direction to start looking, as I am not a mechanic, but am willing to try. Thanks
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Thunder06 01-24-2015 18:02
I sure hope someone is still monitoring this blog, as I could really use some advice on where to start looking for the issues with this car.
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victor 01-25-2015 02:34
I know what the problem is swap the crank pully with your originam engine and it will start right up.let me know if it worked.be careful if u remove the pully then timing is a must.have it done by some one who knows this procedure.
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Thunder06 01-25-2015 16:36
I will try that, and let you know what the outcome is, and just to be clear that the crank pully needs to be swapped even if the new motor came out of the same year car, and is the same motor that's in my car?
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victor 01-25-2015 17:14
It was so for me .
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nojodas67 01-25-2015 19:14
victor,
As I recall, as I've just gone back and re-read your posts; You just talked about replacing your crankshaft, not swapping your entire engine for a Fusion engine. If all you did was replace your crank, then why would you have to swap your pulley?

Also, if you have managed to fix your engine and are now back on the road, the least you can do as appreciation to this site is to post what you did with your results, along with any tips you may have, so others can benefit, just like you did.

This was from you a while back: "....Thank you all, i can go ahead with more confidence now + i will post the result when done..."
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nojodas67 01-25-2015 17:19
Hi,
I just read your posts, and although it does not explain the symptoms well, I don't think the problem is the crank pulley. Without actually taking it out and disturbing the timing, you can simply compare the two pulleys (on original engine and on replacement engine). Just count the number of cogs and location of the missing cogs to make sure they are the same. But if the replacement engine is out of a Mazda6, then they should be the same.
About your original problem, you have not stated what engine you have (4 cyl. or 6cyl.), or what the symptoms are: does the starter engage with the key or not? Is there any spark present while engine is cranking? Do the injectors spray in correct sequence while engine is cranking? Has the valve timing been verified by the mechanic that did the swap? Are there any DTC's present? etc...etc...etc...

"...it will not fire at all. They have put it on the computer and only get minimal readings on it. " It's clear you may not know much about engine diagnostic procedures, and thus I have no idea what the above sentence means. In order to begin to help, please explain the problem by answering the questions above.
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Thunder06 01-25-2015 21:57
Hey I appreciate both of you responding to my problem, I will know more Tuesday about the car is actually doing. The last thing I got from the mechanic was the car was not getting fire, and the TCM code was showing up when they hooked the computer up to it. The entire engine was swapped out, the car is a 2003 mazda 6 and the replacement engine was out of a 2003 mazda 6 with 36000 miles on it. I figured it would be an easy swap, but now the car wont start. I will provide you with more details Tuesday if you guys are still on here. I just know its costing a lot of money right now, and the shop told me they were out of ideas. Thanks again
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Thunder06 01-26-2015 22:57
Hey, I talked with the mechanic that is working on the 2003 mazda 6. We had an identical motor from another 2003 mazda 6 put in this car. The new motor has only 36000 miles on it. The car will not fire with the new motor in it, the mechanic said he could jump the motor from the battery to the starter and will turn over all day, but no fire. They put it on 3 different computers in an attempt to get some kind of reading, but all they get is a message saying is it stolen. Is there anything we can do to fix this problem without changing the computer in the car. If you could give me a call I would greatly appreciate it. My number is 573-330-4812. Thanks or you could email me your number and I will call you.
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Thunder06 01-26-2015 23:32
Oh by the way the motor is a 4cyl 2.5 liter.
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nojodas67 01-27-2015 01:40
You meant to say 2.3L, correct?

It sounds like the immobilizer in the car is not letting the starter kick in, nor the injectors or ignition coils. There was someone else here that wrote about a similar issue with the alarm system thinking the car was stolen and the pcm not communicating with the key module. It was sometime in October 2014. In this webpage, do a search with the user name "Don", then you'll find his posts. It looks like the mechanic (s) that did the swap damaged a connector or inadvertently erased the immobilizer's memory.
I hope Don's posts help you...it sure sounds like the same problem though.
This is why I encourage everyone to post their results after a swap so that others can benefit.
Good luck.
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Thunder06 01-27-2015 01:57
Thanks I will look that up and try what Don did, and let you know how it goes. One more question, the engine swap would not mean that any computer components could have to be changed, right. Thanks
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Thunder06 01-27-2015 02:08
I did find Dons post and read what he had done, but he used a fusion engine where I used an engine from another 2003 mazda 6 exact same motor. Any good information on where and how to start tracing down the issue. Anything would be better than I have right now. I also failed to mention that the car sit for about 7 months after the motor blew up, and was told that the battery in the main computer may have also went dead, therefore the main computer would have to be replaced as well. Is that true? Thanks
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nojodas67 01-27-2015 03:08
The 2.3L engines found in Mazda cars are identical in design to the 2.3L engines found in Ford cars. These engines are interchangeable (except for the crank pulley sensor wheel and thickness of timing chains). The Mazda engines are built in Japan or Dearborn, Michigan, the Ford engines are built in Chihuahua, Mexico. The Ford engines seem to be more robust than the Mazda engines of the same design, as I have yet to find a Fusion or Milan with a blown engine; I believe that the use of a thicker timing chain in the Ford engine is the main contributing factor to the low failure rate.
So, to answer your question, there is NO NEED to reprogram the ECM or replace any electronic modules when swapping these engines, either by using a replacement Fusion or Mazda engine. Your problem is that your mechanic either damaged a connector, shorted the ECM or inadvertently erased the immobilizer memory.
If the immobilizer memory is erased, it can be re-programmed and married to the ECM again, by any capable locksmith for about $80. What I would do first, in your case, is to follow Don's procedure of making sure that the immobilizer is communicating with the ECM, TCM and BCM.
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Thunder06 01-27-2015 03:28
Thank you for your advice, and if its found out that the immobilizer is or is not communicating with the ECM, TCM, and BCM, what are the next steps in the process. How do you tell if you damage a connector or shorted the ECM, is there some way to look and tell or is there a test that needs to be run? Thanks
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nojodas67 01-27-2015 04:05
Read Don's post: 10-14-2014 02:54

Also, look at the webpage he posted: http://www.automotivetroubleshootingsecrets.com/2004%20Mazda%20Bus%20wiring%20network.html#sthash.AxRQZf9E.dpuf

These procedures may be beyond your automotive knowledge but your mechanic should be able to follow them.
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MartinB 01-28-2015 18:27
Thank you for the great guide! After developing a rod knock I replaced the 160k mi engine in my 2005 Mazda 6 with an 51k mi 2008 Fusion engine. The process worked great thanks to the information in this guide and the service manual. The spark plugs for the Fusion engine are different (more reach, more threads) so I am using that type now. At initial start-up, the idle was surging and I got an engine code indicating a crank sensor malfunction. It looked like the sensor was bumped, so after checking the sensor and wiring I adjusted the location of the sensor to better line up with the 9th tooth. That fixed it. Took another day of driving for idling rpm to calibrate itself. Now it runs perfect!
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nojodas67 01-28-2015 19:59
Congratulations on a job well done. It just goes to show that this swap is pretty straight forward, as long as people follow this guide right down to the "t". Everything is pretty well spelled out. The only people that have run into trouble have been the ones that either had someone else do the swap, or did not read the instructions carefully and followed them exactly.
Again...congrat s.
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Thunder06 01-31-2015 15:56
Hey, nothing seems to be working on this car, the only thing working is the headlights, and the red flashing security light on the dash, along with some gauges. I am going to bring the car home and try to figure something out, or sell it. If anyone can give me a good starting point please let me know. Thanks
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nojodas67 01-31-2015 18:21
If the security light is flashing rapidly, then the problem is obviously related to the immobilizer. By following Don's posts, and once you verify that you have good communication between modules (again, by following Don's posts), then just call a locksmith. He can reprogram the immobilizer and reflash the ECM, this should cost no more than $80-100 and the locksmith would come to wherever the car is. No need to tow it anywhere. After the immobilizer, ECM and BCM are programmed, then you'll be able to start the car. It will never start if the security light (light on dash shaped like a key) is flashing as soon as you insert the key in the ignition and try to start.
I don't know who did your swap, but the mechanic (if he calls himself that) should know this already. This is basic information and common knowledge for all cars post-1996.
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Thunder06 02-01-2015 03:52
Thanks for your post nojadas67, when I get the car home, I will try what is in Dons post, but I was told by the mechanic that a locksmith attemted to reprogram the immobilizer, but was unable to start the car afterwards. I really do not think that this person knows what they are doing with a Mazda. They seem to think that the car will never run again, and that someone has messed with the security system somehow. I dont know, because I am not in possession of the car at this time. I again thank you for your comments and will keep you posted on the car progression.
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Chris S 02-11-2015 04:19
I hate to leave such a seemingly silly suggestion, but have you tried a new battery? My Mazda6 exhibited symptoms like you describe after it was sitting around, while I was working on its stereo. The OEM batteries don't seem very good on these cars, and the immobilizer seems to go nuts if there isn't enough voltage.
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Don 02-22-2015 15:50
Just checked back in to say my Mazda3 swap where I had the Immobilizer issue is still running well.

Thunder06,
Let the security light blink for a while. At some point you will see that it is blining a code sequence. That sequence will tell you what is wrong. In my case it blinked 1-6. IE code 16. That is communications failure on the CANBUS. If the CANBUS is down then an OSBD2 code reader returns crap. You must clear the CANBUS error if it exists. The CANBUS error is almost certainly a damaged connector.
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charles 02-02-2015 00:37
Hay can you use a 2010 2.3 escape motor for a 2004 mazda 3 swap or can I not just wondering cuz I found one very cheap.
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Troutkiller 02-14-2015 15:50
Great write up guys! Lots of good info here. I have an 06 mazda tribute 2.3 that I bought a few months ago from my neighbor with a blown engine. I only gave $300 for it and other than the blown motor it's a nice low mileage, one owner car. (Motor blew cause the o/o let her son use it for a while and he did an oil change himself, got stoned and forgot to put any oil back in the thing.) when I bought it I figured I would put a used motor in it and have a descent little family car, perfect for vacations and such. I had no idea that a used motor would be 2500 bones! I came across this thread yesterday and read the whole thing. At first it seemed like a god send. But now I'm not so sure. I'm wondering, is the ford swap a good idea? Will that vvt system leave me and my family stranded? Would saving for the mazda motor leave me any better off? Would it be worth it? Or should I just put a motor in this car and sell it!? Ain't gonna lie, I like the little car. While hunting the local u-pull-it's for a motor, I've found a like new leather interior for $100. Found a good deal on new tires. I've done some work to it. Even stopped at a used car lot and test drove one just like it. We like the way it drives. So give it to me straight guys. I know it's only your opinion but your honest opinion is what I'm asking for. Is it worth keeping with a ford engine? Should I keep saving for a mazda or just fix and sell? Thanks in advance
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nojodas67 02-15-2015 17:30
Troutkiller,
You wrote "I came across this thread yesterday and read the whole thing", but I don't think you really did or you just skimmed through it and missed most of it; All your questions or concerns have already been addressed.
To help you out, I will spell out each of your concerns point-by-point, so you won't have to go back and read the whole guide and all the posts, since it's getting very long now.
First off, let me just say that you stole that Tribute, $300 for a low mileage Tribute (running or not) is a great score.

* You failed to mention if the Tribute had a 4 or 6 cyl. engine, but I will assume it's a 4 cyl as I make this point: Your Tribute DOES NOT have VVT. All 4 cyl. 2005-2008 Tribute or Escape (same vehicle) have the non-VVT 2.3L engines.

* These 2.3L engines are great, but the VVT system is the main cause for all the premature failures we've all read about and experienced in Mazda6 and Mazda3 cars. There have also been a small number of failed 2.3L engines in both Mazda and Ford vehicles (with and without VVT) due to poor maintenance like longer oil change intervals or using conventional motor oils. So since your Tribute/Escape engine does NOT have VVT, then you can expect a long service life out of it, but only if it's properly maintained.


(continued below)
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nojodas67 02-15-2015 17:31
* From reading your post, you seem to think that Mazda 2.3L engines are more reliable or just overall better than Ford 2.3L engines, but you have it backwards. I have purchased over 2 dozen Mazda cars with failed 4-bangers, which I've swapped in Ford engines in all these vehicles and resold. You will also read about many many cases, in this site and Mazda forums that people have swapped their failed Mazda engines for Ford engines and are running strong after many years. I have yet to come across for sale, or yet to read about, a Fusion or Milan with a failed engine.

* You also seem to think that Mazda 2.3L engines and Ford 2.3L engines are different, but the block and head of these motors are identical. The only difference in the two engines is the thickness of the timing chains and the fact that Mazda's are produced in USA and Japan and Ford 2.3L's are assembled in Mexico. There's a whole Wikepedia article about the Duratec 4 cyl. engine family, if you care to do some more reading.
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nojodas67 02-15-2015 17:31
* Mazda uses a thinner valve-timing chain and thinner balance-shaft chain than Ford. All metal chains will stretch (regardless of manufacturer), but generally, the thinner the chain the faster the rate of stretch. Once the chain stretches to a point where the tensioner is unable to take up the slack, then the chain WILL jump, causing catastrophic failure. So anyone that owns a Mazda can prolong it's engine life by replacing the timing chains every 60-80k miles (like if it had a belt instead of a chain) or install a Ford chain and sprocket set instead, which will prolong the change intervals to about 150k.

In your case, go to www.car-part.com and shop for an engine for a 2006-up Ford Focus (not Fusion) 2.3L (Non-vvt), closest to you, to swap into your Tribute. You should be able to pick up a good low-mileage engine for $500-750. Remember to use only pure synthetic oil and replace the chains, tensioner and guides at 120k to be safe.

Good luck.
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Troutkiller 02-18-2015 19:11
I can pick up a 2010 escape motor with 27k on it right now for $500. I don't if it will go on my 06 tribute though. I worry about all the connectors being different, like on the harness etc... Also not sure if all the accessories will mount in tbe same spot. I know I'm a bit off topic here but I'm not having any luck finding good info. Funds are tight and I can't afford to buy the wrong motor (or the right one, lol) and if this thing sets broken in my driveway much longer my wife may never have sex with me again!!!
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nojodas67 02-18-2015 21:33
2010 Escape is a 2.5L, not 2.3L. It will work but you'll need to swap the harness for the coils, the connectors are different. $500 is a good price for that motor. Make sure the motor came out of an Escape with VIN:7 (8th digit), NOT VIN:3.
Follow this guide to complete the swap, read from beginning to end. You'll need to buy a set of timing tools (This is a must). Once you remove the crankshaft pulley bolt to swap the crankshaft pulley, the timing will be off, and the only way to time it correctly is with the special timing tools, like these:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Massive-Cam-Timing-Alignment-Tools-303-465-574-507-Zetec-Duratec-MZR-2-0-2-3-SVT-/251737794804?hash=item3a9cbde8f4&item=251737794804&pt=Motors_Automotive_Tools&vxp=mtr

Good luck.
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nojodas67 02-18-2015 21:42
I just went back and read your last post again, but this sentence in particular really bothered me. "I know I'm a bit off topic here but I'm not having any luck finding good info. "....
Say What???????? Everything you need to know about doing a successful Ford engine swap into your Tribute is in this website; and I have spent a lot of time writing several very detailed posts to you about your specific issue. :(
If you don't think you're up to the task of doing this swap, then don't say you can't find the right information. Maybe you should just sell the Tribute so you can have sex again :) BTW: I'd love to take it off your hands, since I already have an engine for it ready to drop in.
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Troutkiller 02-19-2015 01:49
Quoting nojodas67:
I just went back and read your last post again, but this sentence in particular really bothered me. "I know I'm a bit off topic here but I'm not having any luck finding good info. "....
Say What???????? Everything you need to know about doing a successful Ford engine swap into your Tribute is in this website; and I have spent a lot of time writing several very detailed posts to you about your specific issue. :(
If you don't think you're up to the task of doing this swap, then don't say you can't find the right information. Maybe you should just sell the Tribute so you can have sex again :) BTW: I'd love to take it off your hands, since I already have an engine for it ready to drop in.

Meant off topic because this thread is not about the mazda tribute. And meant couldn't find any good info anywhere other than here. And in my first post... Really did read your whole write up, didn't know anything about vvt before I read it. That's why I was asking your opinion on which motor would be best for me. Calm down brother, lol. Meant no disrespect. I'd buy you a beer if I could! I sincerely appreciate your help!!
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nojodas67 02-19-2015 05:31
This site was originally about Mazda6, but other models have been mentioned in later posts, like Mazda3, Mazda5, Escape and Tribute as well. You should be fine with the engine you found. Just follow the guide exactly, and let us know if you run into difficulty.
Here's another tip: Whenever I do a swap on any Mazda, I always remove the core support to make the swap a lot easier; but in an Escape and Tribute, the core support is welded to the inner structure, so I always cut the core support behind the headlights, to make it easy for removal and installation of the engine. Then once it's running, I drive it to a local body shop to have the core support spot welded again for $60...saves me a lot of work.
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Trout 02-19-2015 07:09
Thanks for the tip, nojo. I planned on pulling it out the front anyway cause my garage is too short. Cherry picker would be hitting the ceiling before the motor is hi enough to clear the core support. Gotta put in some overtime at the shipyard so it will be a couple weeks before I can do the swap but I'll let y'all know how it goes. Hopefully when I'm done and not when I'm pulling my hair out, lol.
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victor 02-18-2015 22:38
Troutkiller do not kill the truth and confess that u did not spend time reading the answers here. if u are mechanically inclined this is the right post for u.please take the time to read and have sex next.
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Troutkiller 02-19-2015 01:44
Quoting victor:
Troutkiller do not kill the truth and confess that u did not spend time reading the answers here. if u are mechanically inclined this is the right post for u.please take the time to read and have sex next.

I laid sick in bed for two days. During that time I read the entire post and ALL tbe replies. Perhaps you should not only read, but try to comprehend what people are saying before you are so quick to accuse someone of being a liar.
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michael 02-26-2015 19:05
Where do i get the bolt for the crankshaft pulley? no auto parts stores has it or even order it.
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Artem Vestsorov 02-26-2015 19:19
As far as I know, the pulley bolt is a dealer only item. You can get it at a Ford or Mazda dealer.
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nojodas67 02-26-2015 22:35
I have never replaced one of these crankshaft bolts and never had a problem. Just reuse the bolt, you'll be fine. Every time you torque one of these torque-to-yield bolts, it stretches a little. I think you can re-torque them up to 3 times. I torqued one of these 4 times 2 years ago and it's still holding.
Important: Don't forget the special diamond coated washer in between the crank gear and crank pulley. (and behind each cam gear). I also re-use or re-torque head bolts a couple of times before replacing them; I've done this in the past 20 years and never had one bolt fail on me.
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Craig 03-02-2015 17:38
Was wondering about the focus 2.3. I have a 07 Mazda 6 and have a chance to buy a 07 Ford focus 2.3l. Are the changes the same as the fusion? I don't see too many people commenting on using a focus engine. So my question is will the focus engine swap in as a fusion 2.3 or is there a major difference?? Thanks
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nojodas67 03-02-2015 22:57
This very issue has already been discussed in great detail. Go back and read the posts. Furthermore, If you have already read this entire guide, and still don't know the obvious big difference between the Focus and Fusion engines, then I really don't think you should try to perform this swap.
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michael 03-02-2015 21:23
Ok. So i had a guy swap in a 2007 ford fusion engine in my 2005 mazda 6. He called me and i went to check it out. It idles rough. the engine surges and there is a camshaft error code when he hooked the computer up to it. he swapped the timing cover from the mazda 2.3 to the ford 2.3. he also swapped the crank pulley, crank sensor, cam sensor.
The intake cam on the mazda engine has 6 teeth on the timing cog. so he didnt change that over. there is also what sound like valve noise coming from the top of the engine. it doesnt sound like rod knock or anything because my old engine had a rod knock.
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michael 03-02-2015 21:44
Update. the is no more knocking or anything. the idiot left 2 of 3 bolts loose on one of the pulleys. so the noise is gone. but it still idles bad and surges. he left the square coil on plug wires on. would that make any difference?
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nojodas67 03-02-2015 22:54
This guide was really intended for the do-it-yourselfe r, not for you to tell someone else, what to do or how to do it. In order to do this right, a person has to read this entire guide in order to follow the proper procedures and figure out exactly which parts need to be swapped for certain year Mazda 6's. I strongly and highly doubt any paid "parts changer" is going to take the time to read this entire guide in order to do this right. At this point, ONLY he knows what steps were done correctly and what shortcuts he thought he could take or which steps he could skip.
From your original post, and according to what you stated, I think your hired hand should not have swapped the timing cover. As it states in this guide, if you DO NOT have to swap the intake cam, then you should not have to swap the timing cover either. At this point, I suggest to just forward this link to him and have him retrace ALL his steps to see what he did wrong or forgot to do.
Good luck.
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michael 03-02-2015 23:23
i pulled code p0340 and p0301. I dont want to take it back to him at this point because the half ass job he did so far. Im thinking when he changed the crankshaft pulley. He didnt set the timing exactly right. He said the only things he changed was the timing cover, crankshaft pulley, crankshaft sensor, camshaft sensor, oil sensor. also swapped over the intake and throttle body because the fusion engine didnt have one at all.
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michael 03-03-2015 22:36
the misfire on cylinder one turned out to be a cracked spark plug. car is running fine now. just the cam sensor code. one last thing i noticed is that after running the car and checking the oil dip stick. the whole stick is covered with oil. and when i remove the oil fill cap there seems to be alote of air coming out. other than that the car runs normal.
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nojodas67 03-04-2015 02:03
I'm glad you figured it out and that it was something so simple. If you were able to do that on your own, then you were probably quite capable of doing the swap by yourself and do a much better job. Now back to your issue: At some point, you will have to verify that the timing was set correctly by the other guy, it has to be perfect or it will never run right; it is much harder to do this with the engine in the car, but it's doable.
Here are a couple of videos to help you out:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IL5P7wEIymM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4jcoRG2Av0

Good luck.
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nojodas67 03-04-2015 02:07
These engines do have some air movement through the valve cover, out of the pcv valve and back into the intake manifold. It's normal. Excessive air movement however could be caused by valve timing being slightly off.
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John 03-16-2015 02:32
Success story! After 8 months and 20,000 kilometers on it and still running strong. But what causes this problem why the knocking and why do this engine blow up and mazada doesn't do anything about it.
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nojodas67 03-16-2015 13:09
This is a re-type of what I already wrote in earlier posts:
* I have purchased over 2 dozen Mazda cars with failed 4-bangers, which I've swapped in Ford engines in all these vehicles and resold. There are many many cases, in this site and other Mazda forums that people have swapped their failed Mazda engines for Ford engines and are running strong. I have yet to come across for sale, or yet to read about, a Fusion or Milan with a failed engine.

* Mazda 2.3L engines and Ford 2.3L engines are identical. The only difference in the two engines is the thickness of the timing chains and the fact that Mazda's are produced in USA and Japan and Ford 2.3L's are assembled in Mexico. There's a whole Wikepedia article about the Duratec 4 cyl. engine family, if you care to do some more reading.
* Mazda uses a thinner valve-timing chain and thinner balance-shaft chain than Ford. All metal chains will stretch (regardless of manufacturer), but generally, the thinner the chain the faster the rate of stretch. Once the chain stretches to a point where the tensioner is unable to take up the slack, then the chain WILL jump, causing catastrophic failure. So anyone that owns a Mazda can prolong it's engine life by replacing the timing chains every 60-80k miles (like if it had a belt instead of a chain) or install a Ford chain and sprocket set instead, which will prolong the change intervals to about 150k.
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Al 03-16-2015 17:26
Hello,

Where can you purchase the timing tools from?
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Dante 03-25-2015 17:41
Timing tool.
www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=mazda%20timing%20tool
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Wesley512 03-20-2015 14:45
Okay engine on my 2011 mazda 6 2.5l blew up on me. ( the rod went through the block). Anybody have an idea as to what the difference is with this guyide and that engine. Thanks
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Charles York 03-20-2015 23:56
Hay i just did swap with my 04 mazda 3 2.3 with a ford fusion 2.5 2010 and my imbolizer will not allow my starter to turn the flywheel i was just wondering if you guys had any insight on what the problem might be . i have had a relay problem with the car before so i am going to try and get a relay for the car and see if that is my problem but if anyone can come up with another reason why this would happen or how i can fix it plz let me know
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nojodas67 03-25-2015 18:35
There have been others with the same symptoms as yours that have posted their issue and solutions in this guide. You'll just have to go back to the beginning, do a search and read their posts.
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Craig 03-25-2015 19:47
@nojodas67 I bought a 2.3 engine that was supposed to have come out of a 2008 ford fusion. the engine serial number is 8r221518. In your previous post you mentioned that the first digit is the model year and a r1 should be a fusion and a r8 should be something else. Can you tell me what an r2 is? Thanks
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nojodas67 03-26-2015 04:40
Quoting Craig:
@nojodas67 I bought a 2.3 engine that was supposed to have come out of a 2008 ford fusion. the engine serial number is 8r221518. In your previous post you mentioned that the first digit is the model year and a r1 should be a fusion and a r8 should be something else. Can you tell me what an r2 is? Thanks

R2 is also Fusion, but manufactured at a different plant, than R1 vehicles, . I hope you knew that the engine you bought had high mileage, it came out of a Fusion in Oregon with over 104k when involved in an accident which resulted in a frontal impact; be sure to look for stress cracks in the areas near the front motor mount and side mounts. I highly suggest replacing the timing chain, gears and tensioner prior to doing the swap.
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Craig 03-27-2015 06:07
Thanks for the information. I don't understand the vehicle being from Oregon because I purchased the motor from a scrap yard in southern Ontario. Do you have a website where you can decode the engine serial number? I tried phoning a couple of ford dealers and they knew nothing about identifying the engine by the serial number. I will look at the chain when I remove the rocker cover. thanks for your help.
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Craig 03-27-2015 06:30
Also, I would appreciate it if you could send me the vin number of the vehicle the engine was in. I think it would be good to have if I have to order some parts for the engine.
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nojodas67 03-27-2015 12:20
You're welcome. Full vin is: 3FAHP07Z78r221518

Most salvage buyers buy their wrecks online now, from online salvage auctions all over North America, then ship the cars back to their yard.

http://www.salvagedb.com/search?q=3FAHP07Z78r221518
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nojodas67 03-27-2015 12:29
Ford decoder:
http://www.fleet.ford.com/partsandservice/vin-decoder/
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Craig 04-03-2015 01:07
@nojodas67 Thank you for your help. My son and I finished the swap and it all went very smoothly. We started the engine up Tuesday evening and this morning (Thursday) the last of the emission monitors (evap) set and the vehicle passed emissions. I have now transferred the ownership into my name. The vehicle we put it in is branded rebuilt and I was wondering if you could shed any light on it's history. I am wondering why it was branded salvage because I don't see any indication of a major collision. The vin # is 1YVHP85C975M064 80
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nojodas67 04-03-2015 02:57
@Craig: You're very welcome. I'm very glad it worked out for you. If you followed my advice and put in new timing chain and gears, it should last another 150k. I have bought and sold over 100 cars with salvage titles; most had little to NO physical damage. For instance, if your car is stolen and not found within 30 days, your insurance will write it off as a total loss and pay you for it. When the keystone cops finally find it, usually after the 30 days have passed, the car is then branded salvage, whether is has any damage or NOT.
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nojodas67 04-03-2015 03:14
(con't) The same happens if the car is driven through a deep puddle of water and stalls, the car will be written off as a flood car and issued a salvage title, whether there was any engine damage OR NOT. I just purchased a 2014 Grand Caravan R/T with 10k miles, that started right up after I trailered it home; I paid $9k assuming it had a hydro-locked engine, which was not the case and not a drop of water ever went in the passenger compartment. A similar regular titled car, according to KBB it's worth $24k, I should be able to sell it for $16-18k easily. I've sold about a dozen like that this year alone. The same is true if you accidentally leave a window or the sunroof open in the rain, even if it's just for 5 minutes, the car will be considered a flood car.
Anyway, the car you inquired about was issued an Ontario salvage title as a result of a collision on the left side of the car.
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Al 03-30-2015 05:21
2006 L3 engine. Looking for what to use to install the flywheel bolts. Loctite or sealant? The Mazda Engine Service manual does not show anything yet there is obviously something on the threads of the removed bolts. I have new bolts as the manual says to use. Can someone help with this?
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Juan 04-30-2015 18:06
I have a 2004 Mazda 6 2.3 the engian is no good, can I put a 2004 Mazda 3 2.3 in it? Is there any parts I need to swap over from the bad engine to the new Mazda 3 that I'm putting in? Will the Mazda 6 transs work with the Mazda 3? Any help will be much appreciated.
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Daniel 05-02-2015 05:42
can I just used the short block of a 2007 ford fusion and reused the complete cylinder head of my 2004 mazda 3? I say this because the rod broke my block and and just want t block because I want the get a master kit and rebuild the whole engine.
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Tony 05-07-2015 14:49
Hi how can i swap my 2007 Mazda Turbo 2.3 lit on ford engine 2.3 lit, and i noticed that the Ford engine 2.3 lit Block is almost the same but my problem is the oil supply from the Block to the Turbo pipes are not there,
so any solution for that oir it wont fit.
Thanks.
Tony.
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Rob 05-13-2015 16:21
Hello,

Thanks so much for this guide and passing along your knowledge and experience, this is awesome. I just needed to know, is the 05 Mazda engine with the coils on the spark plug as easy a job as the 06-08 Mazda swap? Should I follow the same part swaps such as crankshaft pulley, crank position sensor, etc?
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Toeli 05-20-2015 08:54
Hello all,
I am looking in to swapping my 2004 1.8l Mazda 6 as it starts using 1liter oil every 1000 kilometers. (european car)

I'm thinking of putting a 2.3l mazda6 engine in, are there things to keep in mind? (I know ill have to swap the ecu aswell)

I have done quite a lot of engine swaps with my motorbikes, but not yet with a car.
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Bob 07-08-2015 05:02
Hello,
I'm putting a Fusion 2.5 in a '04 Mazda 3 but don't have any info about the motor, what year Fusion it came out of, mileage, etc. I was wondering if anyone has the ability to access any of that info with the serial number off the block. It is CR322806.

Thanks in advance.
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Bob 07-19-2015 15:29
Quoting Bob:
Hello,
I'm putting a Fusion 2.5 in a '04 Mazda 3 but don't have any info about the motor, what year Fusion it came out of, mileage, etc. I was wondering if anyone has the ability to access any of that info with the serial number off the block. It is CR322806.

Thanks in advance.

Ok, figured this out. It turns out that the engine serial number, CR322806, is the last eight digits of the VIN. After doing a bunch of Google searches to no avail, I tried searching the number above with an * wildcard in front of it, and I found a wrecked car auction site with the wrecked 2012 Fusion that my engine came out of. So now I know that my motor has about 83k on it. I actually had to drop the letters (CR) and searched just *322806 to get it to come up on google.

I bought the engine from a guy I didn't know on craigslist and he didn't have any paperwork for it. It was nice to find out where my engine came from and also its mileage. Hopefully this might help someone else.
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Troutkiller 07-25-2015 16:58
Hey guys, been a few months since I posted in here about swapping motors in my 06 tribute. Stuff just keeps coming up. But I've been tooling on it for a couple hours this morning. I have a 2.5 here from a 2011 fusion that is suppose to be a direct replacement for a 2011 tribute. 58k on it and it was $600 shipped. Figure I'll make it work. Hoping this will be another success story but so far it's been a pain in the ass. Mostly cause I just returned back to work after an accident in the shipyard that left me on workman comp for a month and I'm still pretty banged up. But the wife is going back to work and she is driving my corolla and I'm having to drive my 13 mpg old truck with no ac for my 91 mile commute so... Here goes nothing. Biggest problem so far is that the original motor is locked up so I have to pull the teaming with the motor. That's a lot more work!! Should have it out the car by now but I'm moving pretty slow. I'll check back in when I'm done swapping parts, hopefully to tell y'all how smooth it went and not to say, oh my god, wtf do I do. Might be worth mentioning that I've read a few post where guys have done the same swap as me and didn't change anything but intakes and reported success. Even said to get a 90" belt. My wife is gonna be driving this thing so I'm not gonna even try that. Y'all wish me luck and thanks for all the tips
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Bob 07-25-2015 20:20
Good Luck!
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Troutkiller 07-26-2015 14:47
Didn't get it out yesterday like I hoped. And off to a slow start today. The slipped disc, torn ligaments in my shoulder, broken collar bone & two broken ribs from six weeks ago was feeling better, till I started bending over a car! Really sore today but old motor is ready to come out, I think. I'm gonna try suspending the motor from the hoist and sliding the motor away from the trans enough to get at the torque converter bolts. I know I'm running the risk of getting it hung up but screw it, I'm gonna gamble!
What are you guys doing about the intake? It's so close that I'm tempted to rtv it but I don't wanna have to work on it again. What about using paper gasket material and making a gasket? That's what I'd do if it were metal, don't know about this plastic though. I can make an aluminum spacer at work tomorrow but I still have hope of getting the new motor in the car today. I'll let y'all know what I end up doing and how it works out. Guess I shoulda been posting sooner so I'd have time for responses. Loratabs kicking in, time to get to work!!
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Troutkiller 07-26-2015 15:01
Oh shit, forgot to mention... When I removed the intake on the 2.5 I found motor oil in it. Is that normal? Also a little oil on the intake runners as well. Also found it in the old motor as well. But that's not really reassuring since I can see completely through the block and out the other side!! Lol. Motor came with a six month free replacement warranty but it's gonna suck if I have to do all this again. Really hoping to see a reply about this soon. Thanks in advance
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Artem Vestsorov 07-27-2015 06:46
A little oil in the intake is normal and is caused by the PCV system. As for the intake, take a look at http://www.fordfusionclub.com/showthread.php?t=655122. There is a guy on there that is selling an 2.3 -> 2.5 adapter plate. Of course if you can make one yourself then more power to ya. That thread has some good info on 2.3 -> 2.5 differences.
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Troutkiller 07-31-2015 17:59
Thanks for the reply artem. When I pulled the intake on the "new" motor it left about a 6-8" puddle of oil on the ground. And it's setting in a substantial puddle right now where I sat it on the garage floor last weekend. Hopefully it's normal, or maybe the car it came out of was a rollover? Regardless, I'm gonna run it and see what happens.
I think I've already read the thread you mentioned. Is that the one where the guy sells an adapter plate and gasket for $100? I thought about getting one from him but decided to make one. Got a clean piece of 3/16" aluminum plate out of the scrap pile at work. Gonna match the outside perimeter to the new motor and the runners to the old intake. Mark it, rough cut it with a jig saw, then finish it off with a file and some sandpaper. I had lots of other more time consuming and "better" ideas but I think as long as my adapter is about 1/32" larger than my intake ports it should dump clean. And a penny saved... Plan was to have it done by now but life happened so I'm taking today off, hopefully to get everything swapped over and the new motor ready to install in the am. Oh yea, forgot to mention... New intake gaskets and gonna make a gasket from generic gasket material on the head side. Should work fine. Fingers crossed
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Troutkiller 08-01-2015 16:23
Wow, everything went really smooth! My tribute is an 06 so I didn't need to mess with the crank pulley or camshafts. At least that's what I've been reading. I was super excited right up till the last step, putting the belt on. Motor mount on the 2.5 is bigger and beefier than the 2.3. The belt won't clear it. Motors coming back out to swap timing covers. Guess I'll go ahead and swap pulleys since they are coming off and fill that oil passage that I read about with some rtv just to be safe. This sucks!
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Dmitry 08-07-2015 11:10
Hello, I know English is not much, so do not judge strictly !
The situation is this , if I can put the engine from the Mazda 6 in the Ford Fusion, I know exactly what Mazda 6 release from 2006+ exactly fit , and if the engine is 2003, VVTi, what I have to do ?
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Quentin 08-11-2015 22:35
If I'm not doing the work myself, is the savings on the engine worth it with the extra parts and labor needed. Thanks
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tram 08-12-2015 05:10
I have a good low mileage 2.3 engine out of a 2004 Ford Ranger are there any chance it would work in my 2005 Mazda 6. thanks
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Ian 08-13-2015 20:25
Hey so this may sound pretty noobish but im a college student who cant afford the mechanical work for what is wrong with my car so im doing it myself. My problem is im trying to rotate my camshafts back to their correct positions because i didnt do what i was supposed to do when i was taking this all apart. I have a chain wrench but it kinda sucks so if there's any other options im all eyes and ears. Oh also i have basically the entire engine apart that is my plugs and coils are out, valve cover, timing cover ,pulleys, chains, etc if that helps you help me. Also I dont have the means to remove the engine so thats another difficulty. If anyone can help email me:
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Troutkiller 08-17-2015 02:21
Lot of good info in this thread and the original post may be dead on. But the peeps here that said that a newer 2.5 can be swapped into a 2.3 mazda tribute and even offer advice on how to do it are dead wrong. You can not swap a 2.5 for a non vvt 2.3. I know this cause I followed the advice given here and wasted a whole bunch of money that I couldn't afford to waste. As stated, everything else here may be factual but the advice given to me here was false. You can not use this guide to swap a fusion 2.3 or any 2.5 into an 06+ mazda tribute period. Any one who believes otherwise, I can sell you all the parts that you think you need
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nojodas67 10-31-2015 19:02
Quoting Troutkiller:
Lot of good info in this thread and the original post may be dead on. But the peeps here that said that a newer 2.5 can be swapped into a 2.3 mazda tribute and even offer advice on how to do it are dead wrong. You can not swap a 2.5 for a non vvt 2.3. I know this cause I followed the advice given here and wasted a whole bunch of money that I couldn't afford to waste. As stated, everything else here may be factual but the advice given to me here was false. You can not use this guide to swap a fusion 2.3 or any 2.5 into an 06+ mazda tribute period. Any one who believes otherwise, I can sell you all the parts that you think you need

I've done these swaps not once but 3 times on 2004-on Tribute/Escape. I've swapped in a Fusion 2.3L into a 2006 Tribute and a Focus 2.3L into a 2005 Escape. I also installed a Focus 2.0L (yes, 2.0) into a 2005 Escape, successfully. I also swapped a Fusion 2.3L into a Mazda 5 that had a 2.3L with a rod knock. I also installed a Dodge Avenger 2.4L into a 2007 Kia Rondo, which ALL salvage yards and shops said couldn't be done.
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Bob 08-20-2015 01:53
Just curious - I haven't attempted that swap but am wondering exactly why it wouldn't work, what didn't fit, etc. The details might save somebody else the aggravation and expense.
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tristan 10-28-2015 05:42
2005 mazda 6 2.3L would any of you with the same car have a salvageable piston rod who is willing the sell it to me? I've been reading much about the engine swap from fusion engine and I want to try it but now I can't afford an engine, so i'll try to replace the bad piston rod and se if I give life to my engine again.
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nojodas67 10-31-2015 18:50
Tristan,
I have a few good pistons/rods and I can donate 1 to you (I'll just need $15 for shipping). But most likely your crankshaft is bad too, and not worth fixing. Been there...done that. You'll be wasting your time and money if you only change the bad rod, since you'll have to buy new bearings, head gasket, head bolts, and all the other various parts you'll need to put it back together. Save yourself the headache and just buy a used Fusion motor.
But if you want one rod/piston set, then let me know and you can just send the $15 via Paypal.
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Johnny Teunissen 11-03-2015 15:43
I have a 2008 Ford Fusion with the same engine you swapped into your Mazda. The job I need to do is to replace the automatic transmission as it has gone bad. Do you know if I need to remove the engine in order to remove and replace the transmission? By the way you did a great job on this write up. Very detailed and easy to understand!
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Artem Vestsorov 11-04-2015 22:42
Johnny,
In your case the best thing to do would be to drop the subframe and remove the transmission from the bottom, leaving the engine in place.
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Alex L 11-22-2015 09:24
Went through the majority of comments here and hope that you can help answer. Will a Mazda3 2.5L engine swap into a 2007 Mazda3 with a 2.3L engine?

Does it still require to swap the oil pan and crank pulley?
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Pat M 11-24-2015 14:30
Will this '06-'09 2.3 fusion motor swap work for an '08 2.3 Mazdaspeed3? Anything different than the instructions above because of the turbo?
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Artem Vestsorov 11-25-2015 00:05
Since this question comes up a lot, I have added it to the FAQ portion of the guide.

The answer is no, the Fusion engine will not work in a Mazdaspeed 3 or 6.
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Patrick Murphy 12-09-2015 19:13
Darn! Guess I'll have to get a standard engine...

Do you know happen top know if the motor can come out of the top or does it need to be dropped in the Mazdaspeed3?
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Artem Vestsorov 12-10-2015 00:21
Service manual has you dropping it from the bottom but you can also go from the top. If you plan on taking it out from the top then you will need to raise both the engine and transmission as one unit and lift them at an angle.
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joseph 12-04-2015 13:53
hey so i successfully did this swap i had an 04 mazda 6 and put a 07 mazda 6 motor and trans and swapped over all 04 parts had her running perfect. wife got into accedinent insurance wants to total out the car. the cut us a check and i bought a 04 mazda 3 i got screwwedd over the trans is bad. my car is up for auction and i want to buy it back and take my swap out of the 6 and put it in the mazda 3 but i noticed the layout for motor mounts is different from the 6 do you know if it will drop in. also i think timing cog may be different due to it having indiviual coils. and the 04 mazda 6 having coil distruputor. my main question is will it work. i loved my mazda 6 after i did this conversion and want to know will the 6 also fit in the mazda 3. so pissed i got skrewed over by independent dealer. transmission is done. i know this is motor forum just trying to figure out i know mazda 6 03 to 08 have same motor placement but did the 3 change placement because i noticed on the 3 alternator is in front when 6 is in back. please help me make this deternination sorry for long explenation
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Artem Vestsorov 12-09-2015 02:05
Can confirm that the 2.3 engine in the 6 will work in the 3 with some parts swapping. You will need to use the Mazda 3 oil pan and mount the alternator on the other side of the block. I don't *think* you will need to swap cams but double check if they are the same. Not sure if you will need to swap over the crank pulley, sensor, or timing cover - again visually inspect and swap them if they are different.

I did a quick google and the transmissions look similar but I can't confirm if the 6 trans will work in your 3. You'll need to do some more research on that.
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Ruben 12-08-2015 02:09
I swap a 2007 fusion engine to a Mazda 6 2007 when I give it gas it stalls and doesn't want to run. Any input on why this could be happening?
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Victor 12-08-2015 06:06
Check if throttle body, crank pully,crank pos sensor and cam cog are the same
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Artem Vestsorov 12-09-2015 02:10
Did you use your Mazda 6 crank pulley, crank sensor, and Mazda 6 throttle body on the Fusion engine? Those parts should have been swapped over.
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Jegi 12-08-2015 14:33
I want to swap engine from USA Mazda 6 2007 2.3 L to europecar ford s-max 2.3 l 118 kw. Am i right, will all things go right!? Thanks for answering
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Alex 12-08-2015 17:40
Ok, so I got a 2010 2.5L Mazda3 with 55k from an auto recycler and a new clutch. I cross referenced a few items on Rockauto and it seems this engine has more interchangeable parts than the Fusion motor. Coil plugs for example are identical to the 2.3L Mazda.
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Cardana 12-29-2015 19:48
Hey guys, I just did this swap but it will not start. I know I don't have spark and I have not had any more time to troubleshoot further. I have an 04 Mazda 6 and I have installed an 06 Ford Fusion engine. I have gone back though the guide and I am wondering if I did the cam swap correctly. I took the intake cam and sprocket/gear out of the Mazda engine and put it into the Fusion engine before I installed the engine in the car. Was I supposed to swap the Fusion cam sprocket/gear onto the mazda camshaft? Or does the sprocket/gear matter? Thanks for any advice. I also need to verify that I am using the correct camshaft position sensor because I am pretty sure everything else is right. Thanks for any help.
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nojodas67 12-30-2015 01:46
Hi Cardana,
When swapping in a 2006 Fusion engine into a 2004 Mazda6 body; you not only have to swap the intake camshaft, you have to use the Mazda timing cover, Mazda crankshaft pulley AND Mazda CPS (crank position sensor) as well. You also have to use the Mazda throttle body. The Mazda timing chain is different than the Fusion timing chain, so you do have to use the matching chain/gears. You can use the Fusion chain/Fusion gears or the Mazda chain/Mazda gears, but you cannot mix them up.

We would be able to help you better if you list EXACTLY what steps you took and which parts you used (Mazda vs Fusion).
Also, I hope you have not thrown anything out yet, at least not until the Fusion engine is running properly in the Mazda body.
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Cardana 12-30-2015 02:04
I did swap over all of the parts you listed except for the cam gears and possibly the cam position sensor, I still need to check that. When I put the Mazda cam into the fusion engine I swapped the whole cam shaft with the the gear attached. It looked to be the same size as the one from the fusion engine so I did not think twice about it. But from what you are telling me it sounds like I need to pull the timing cover back off and swap the fusion intake cam gear onto the Mazda intake camshaft. Correct?
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nojodas67 12-30-2015 04:49
I don't know how you could have missed that. It's pretty obvious that the teeth on the Mazda cam gear do not mesh with the Fusion chain. After all, you have to rotate the chain and gears to time the engine correctly. With the wrong gears/chain combination, I don't even think the cams will rotate properly.
Easiest way to check, would be to just pull the valve cover off and closely check if the chain and cam gears mesh properly.
Try that first, and report back.
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Cardana 12-30-2015 13:36
I have a picture of the timing chain on the cams before I put the timing chain cover on but I am not sure how to post pics here. I will pull the valve cover as well. Also if I am using the wrong cam sensor will that cause a no start situation?
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Artem Vestsorov 12-30-2015 15:37
Your 2004 Mazda 6 has a 2 pin cam sensor while the Fusion has a 3 pin sensor. I doubt you are using the wrong one since you wouldn't be able to plug in the Fusion sensor in your Mazda wiring harness.
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Cardana 12-31-2015 15:02
Yeah, I was able to verify that yesterday. I am using the correct sensor.

Also, I am not sold on the cam sprocket/gears being different yet. The reason I say this is because I went out to the garage (the old mazda engine is in my garage, but the car with the new engine installed is not in my garage) and took the Fusion intake cam and put the old mazda timing chain on it and it meshed perfectly. So I am not 100% sure that, the cam gear/sprocket is a problem.

I do need to find the procedure to make sure the crank sensor is installed correctly because I did remove it and did not mark anything and now I see there is some adjustment room.
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nojodas67 12-31-2015 23:14
Happy New Year!

Anyway, I was able to verify that Fusion engines built before 12/03/06 have the same timing chain as the Mazda engines (with 174 chain links); Fusion engines built from 12/04/06 have a different chain and gear teeth pattern (138 link chain).
You must have an early 2006 Fusion engine; that's why the chain/gears are the same as your Mazda engine.
As far as the CPS, the adjustment limits is not enough to keep the engine from running, it should still start, as long as all the other necessary parts have been swapped.
Did you time the engine correctly? Both camshaft bolts and crank bolt have to be loosened in order to time the engine correctly. Since you swapped the intake camshaft together with the cam gear, I'm thinking maybe you did not loosen the intake cam bolt prior to timing the engine.
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Cardana 01-01-2016 22:08
do you have a link to the procedure to properly time the engine? I bought the tools made for the 2.3 engine, the peg for the crank and then the straight piece of metal you slide into the ends of the cam shafts. I set the engine at Tdc, then I removed the timing cover and released the tension on the timing chain. Once I did that I swapped the Mazda cam with sprocket into the head and I used the picture posted in the write up to determine the proper way. Once the intake cam was installed I pit the metal piece back in the rear of the cams to hold them in place. Once they were locked in I put the timing chain back on and reinstalled the tensioner. I never loosened the cam bolts when setting the timing. Is there a guide on doing it? I assumed since the cam lock was installed and the crank was locked the timing would be correct.
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Cardana 01-04-2016 19:07
If the timing were off would that cause a no spark situation? I just went to see the car again to check for spark and I am not getting any spark at all.
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Artem Vestsorov 01-04-2016 22:58
I'm not sure whether it would cause a no spark but you need to verify that the engine is timed correctly. So here is how to verify timing and line up the CPS correctly.

Rotate engine until you get TDC. At that point the slots in rear of the cams should line up and you should be able to install the cam lock bar. You should also be able to install the crank lock pin. In addition, at TDC you will notice that there is small hole in the crank pulley. It should be at 6 o'clock position and you should be able to install a bolt through that hole and thread it into the timing cover (look at page 4, step 5 of the guide). If you were able to do all those steps then the engine is timed correctly.

To line up the CPS. With the engine at TDC and the timing tools installed, look at the teeth on the crank pulley. There will be one large empty space (around 11 o'clock). From that empty space, count 9 teeth counter-clock wise. The center of the 9th tooth should line up with the center line of the CPS. This is the procedure for the 2004 Mazda 6.

From what you wrote it looks like the timing is correct. I suspect a wiring issue - make sure all the ground points are attached correctly. I would also go through all the connectors and make sure that they are free of dirt and connected securely (especially the main harness connection near the fuse box). I think you already mentioned this but you should be using your Mazda throttle body.
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nojodas67 01-04-2016 23:17
Follow Artem's instruction to check the timing.
If the timing is a little bit off, it will NOT cause a no-spark condition. The ECM needs input from both the CPS and cam sensor to direct the coils to create a spark. If the timing is off, the coils will still spark, they will just spark out of time. So it could be that either sensor (or both) is defective.
But before throwing any parts at the problem; first check that you have 12V at the coils with the ignition on, and ground. A commonly missed ground wire is the coil ground. In the guide above, look at the picture under paagraph #9 that begins with "A few more things to remove here...." In that picture, find a red letter "b", about 3" horizontally to the left of "b", you will see a 10mm bolt; THAT IS the ground strap for the coils. Make sure that ground is attached and seated properly.
Let us know if that was it, hopefully.
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Cardana 01-06-2016 18:37
I had a chance to troubleshoot a little bit. The coil does show 12v on the center pin when the key is in the on position when I ground the multi meter black lead to the battery -. But if I just hold my red lead on the center pin and probe the other two pins with the black lead I get nothing. So I am thinking I am having a grounding problem for the coil pack. I checked the two grounds on top of the transaxle that I see and they seem to be good. Since that car that is pictured is a COP car and I have just one coil pack with spark plug wires I am wondering if my wiring is a little different. There is a wire that comes out a few inches below where the coil pack is plugged in and it goes to ground. I am thinking this is probably the ground for the coil. Can anyone verify this? This ground wire in question has a little black box on the end of the wire just before the ring terminal. I'm not sure what this is. Does anyone happed to know which wire should be my ground wire going to my coil? The center wire is black/white and it gets 12volts when the ignition is switched on. The other two wires, one is white and the other is black. I also started a thread on the mazda 6 forum about this issue, and I am going to post this information there along with pictures too. Thanks for any help.
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nojodas67 01-06-2016 22:25
ground the black wire coming out of the coil with a jumper and then check for spark.
The black wire with the "little black box" IS the coil ground. Make sure it is grounded (do a continuity test with your meter between that wire and the battery negative terminal).
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Cardana 01-07-2016 19:08
I just cleaned up the coil ground and the point where it mounts. I checked if for continuity with the negative battery cable and it tested good. I hooked everything back up and I am still getting no spark at all at the plugs. How can I test the coil? I need to find out if the coil is not producing a spark because it is messed up or it is not producing a spark because the computer is telling it not to.
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nojodas67 01-08-2016 04:56
I'm confused, is the below still true or how did this change?

"I had a chance to troubleshoot a little bit. The coil does show 12v on the center pin when the key is in the on position when I ground the multi meter black lead to the battery -. But if I just hold my red lead on the center pin and probe the other two pins with the black lead I get nothing"
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Cardana 01-08-2016 13:59
That is true. I have researched a little more. I was assuming one of the three wires at the coil is ground. I don't think that is the case now. I think those are the switching signal wires, each one is used to fire two cylinders. I assume the ecu controls the switching signal. If the above is confusing then please ignore it. The important part of what I have found is that the center pin at the coil is getting 12 volts but I am not getting spark when the engine is cranked.
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Cardana 01-08-2016 18:48
I changed out the crank and cam sensors...not change. Still no spark. The plugs do not smell like gas either so I assume they are not firing. I do have fuel pressure at the rail. One sensor that I did have to change out when I did the engine swap that is not really talked about is the one that bolts into the head next to the intake came closest to the timing cover. That plug got broken on the Fusion engine, so I swapped over the sensor from the mazda engine. They looked the same, but I thought I would throw it out there incase that is causing a problem.

Also, I checked the voltage at the coil while being cranked. When the key was switched on it showed about 12.5v (same as the battery). Then when cranking it drops down to about 10.5v. I am thinking this is not low enough for no spark, but again I thought I should throw it out.

Where is my spark?
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Cardana 01-08-2016 20:20
one other thing I thought of while I was looking though my pictures from the swap is that when I swapped the intake cams the bolt on the intake cam from the mazda engine came loose when I was loosening the crank shaft, so there for the cam gear turned with out the actual cam turning. So I am positive that the cam gear/sprocket is in a different orientation now than when I removed it from the mazda engine at TDC. I have no reason to believe the actual intake camshaft it's self is not a tdc, but if the actual intake gear/sprocket I am sure is not in the same position. I don't have a clue if this matters, because I don't know if there are tdc marks on the actual gear. Again, if this is a problem would it actually cause the engine not to spark?
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Rod 01-18-2016 09:33
My question is also about the intake cam. With the timing tools in place, I tighten the cam gear bolts then the crankshaft bolt,as soon as I remove the cam holding tool the intake cam springs counter clock wise a few degrees and if I rotate the engine 2 rotations the intake cam is not at tdc.its a few degrees off .Is this normal? Does the VVT gear have to be in a certain position when installed .the car runs great vvt kicks in at 5k rpm but I have a p0016 code.
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Artem Vestsorov 01-18-2016 15:32
When removing the timing chain the exhaust sprocket is the one that needs to be removed, not the VVT gear. The VVT actuator and the intake cam need to be swapped over as a single unit - no need to loosen the cam bolt. If the VVT actuator has to be removed it must be marked and reinstalled in the same position. I know, not much help to you since you already did the swap. Your timing is slightly off so that's probably why you have the code.
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Cardana 01-18-2016 15:45
Is there a guide of how to install the vvt gear if you did not mark the location before removal? The reason I ask is because my vvt gear bolt loosened when I was trying to break the crank bolt free, so I am not sure if my vvt gear is in the proper position in relation to the intake camshaft.
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Artem Vestsorov 01-18-2016 16:43
Not that I know of and there is nothing in the service manual (other than telling you to mark it before removal. I think that as long as you check your timing and find that everything is lined up correctly the position of the VVT gear should also be correct. In Rod's case, he rotated the engine a couple times and saw that the intake cam was off a couple degrees.
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nojodas67 01-19-2016 03:20
Quoting Artem Vestsorov:
Not that I know of and there is nothing in the service manual (other than telling you to mark it before removal. I think that as long as you check your timing and find that everything is lined up correctly the position of the VVT gear should also be correct.

There is a notch in front of the VVT assembly, and this notch should be at 12 o'clock when tightening the bolts.

Quoting Artem Vestsorov:

In Rod's case, he rotated the engine a couple times and saw that the intake cam was off a couple degrees.

This is because BOTH cam gear bolts were not loosened during prior to setting the timing. Proper timing requires BOTH cam gear bolts loosened prior to putting tension on the chain.
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Artem Vestsorov 01-19-2016 03:44
I'm going by the service manual. Nowhere does it state that both cam bolts must be loosened. Everything is done by loosening the exhaust cam gear.

In addition, Rods comment shows that he loosened both cam bolts.
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nojodas67 01-20-2016 14:06
Quoting Cardana:
Is there a guide of how to install the vvt gear if you did not mark the location before removal? The reason I ask is because my vvt gear bolt loosened when I was trying to break the crank bolt free, so I am not sure if my vvt gear is in the proper position in relation to the intake camshaft.

Cardana, I just read your post again and I'm surprised I didn't catch this before. You mentioned "...my vvt gear bolt loosened when I was trying to break the crank bolt free"... You NEVER EVER want to loosen or tighten ANY of these bolts without supporting (or locking) the crankshaft or camshaft. When loosening or tightening the crank bolt, use the flywheel teeth or one of the torque converter bolt holes to lock the crankshaft and keep it from turning. When loosening or tightening the cam bolts, use an open-end wrench on the camshaft, as shown in one of the videos.
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nojodas67 01-19-2016 03:03
Cardana,
Watch these short videos, the proper way to set tension on these engines is to start with BOTH cam bolts AND crankshaft bolts loose, so that even tension is set in the chain ALL the way around. Once proper chain tension is set by the tensioner alone, then you want to install the timing gear cover and tighten the crank bolt first to proper torque, then tighten the exhaust cam bolt, and finally tighten the intake cam bolt.
You DO have to loosen both cam bolts to get proper tension and proper timing alignment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBJ31S2WuaI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4jcoRG2Av0
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nojodas67 01-19-2016 03:12
Artem,
I would suggest putting the links to these videos in the guide (somewhere that's easy to find), for quick reference PRIOR to setting the timing; The videos would have answered most of the questions that have come up by many readers about the proper way of setting the timing on these engines, and will definitely help future readers just as well.
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Rod 01-19-2016 10:35
Thanks guys for the quick response, I should clarify that I did not do a engine swap,I'm just replacing the chain on a mazda 2.3l .Cam gears where never removed from cams ,just loosened. I guess my question is the normal position of the VVT locked all the time if engine is not running? I can watch mine lock and unlock when turning the engine over by hand but I don't think it should do that. Would that cause the timing to be off on the intake cam because of the locking and unlocking of the VVT.
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nojodas67 01-19-2016 13:42
Quoting Rod:
Thanks guys for the quick response, I should clarify that I did not do a engine swap,I'm just replacing the chain on a mazda 2.3l .Cam gears where never removed from cams ,just loosened. I guess my question is the normal position of the VVT locked all the time if engine is not running? I can watch mine lock and unlock when turning the engine over by hand but I don't think it should do that. Would that cause the timing to be off on the intake cam because of the locking and unlocking of the VVT.

VVT gear should be locked at all times. You need to replace it before it goes completely and results in major engine damage (valves hitting the top of pistons).
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Rod 01-20-2016 10:25
That's what I thought, you have a lot of good information here as I'm sure I'll be using it in the future. Thanks again.......... ......
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nojodas67 01-20-2016 14:08
Quoting Rod:
That's what I thought, you have a lot of good information here as I'm sure I'll be using it in the future. Thanks again................

You're very welcome! If your VVT gear is not locking or it's defective, I would not drive that car another mile until the gear is replaced. Otherwise, you'll be doing an engine swap, for sure! :)
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nojodas67 01-25-2016 03:20
Quoting Andy:
After trial n error with 2 engines so far i decided to wait for the "right" engine at our local autowrecker.

I don't understand what you meant by your above statement. Did you already purchase 2 engines?

If you are not comfortable with re-setting the timing on an engine, then your only choice is to purchase a Mazda 3 engine out of a 2005-2008 Mazda 3; there are no other engine options that you can just drop in your car. A Mazda engine sells for about 3 times the price of a Ford 2.3L...this is why most people are going with the Ford engine route, but there is a little work involved to make this swap a success, as so many people here have done. Also, the Ford engine is more reliable than the Mazda, and will last longer...it's been proven time and time again.
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jared 01-27-2016 00:34
So I swapped a 2007 2.3l fusion into my 2008 Mazda 6. Purchased the car 4 years ago with 120km's on it put 3000 on it crank bearings went(yes I always change my oil before its due and according to Mazda that's every 8000 I do it every 5000kms.) Covered under my warranty I bought from the dealer and they put in an engine from the wrecker with 120000 on it. Well 179000 3 years later same problem. My friend and I took on the task and successfully installed I 2007 ford fusion engine with 148000 on it that I got from the wrecker for 500$.

Long story short I've put about 3000kms on it and it seems to be lacking power. When I had the last engine it seemed to hit a power band at 3500 rpm. When we changed the crankshaft sensor between engines we just lined up the marks from where the heads of the bolts were on the sensor and it runs very smooth but I'm wondering if that is the cause of the lack in torque I guess to say it and if so what is an easy way to see the improvement as there is no timing marks for a timing light or anything. Would moving the sensor clockwise looking at the front of the engine (crank pully side) cause timing retard or advance and has anyone done this and seen improvements?
I know between ford and Mazda they say the specs on the engines the ford has more power but we are talking 4hp more for the ford and you don't notice horsepower gains until you hit 50+.
Any help appreciated.
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nojodas67 01-28-2016 03:19
First thing that comes to mind is your VVT may not be engaging, you should definitely feel it kicking in above 3500 rpm's. You didn't clarify if you're feeling a lack of power at all RPM's or only above 3500 rpm. If the latter is correct, then I would start looking at the VVT to be suspect. I once suspected that the VVT in one of my many Mazda's was not advancing intake valve timing, so I spliced a test light at the VVT solenoid and ran the wire inside the car and to the test light, and went for a drive. The bulb lit right above 3500 rpm and under acceleration, but I noticed NO difference in power. I then took off the timing cover and removed the VVT gear. After disassembling it, I was able to verify that it was damaged and heavily scored inside. I bet during VVT engagement, the engine lost all the oil pressure supplied to the VVT, but it was not enough to trigger the oil warning light; it was just a matter of time before the rod bearings suffered the all-familiar fate with these engines. They NEVER should've incorporated an oil-pressure driven VVT system into these engines; 9 out of 10 engine failures have been due to VVT oil pressure leakage, which will eventually result in a bad bearing or two, and rod knock.
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nojodas67 01-28-2016 03:21
I don't thing the small adjustment of the CPS will have any noticeable effect on power. When I played with this adjustment on a few of these engines, I did not notice any difference in power.
As an Aerospace engineer, where all designs must be fail-safe, when I first learned of this engine design without a Woodruff key in both the crank and cam gears, I thought it was pure insanity.
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Rod 01-29-2016 15:33
Well I got the new actuator in and the cars runs very well ,however I can't seem to get rid of the p0016 code. the crank position is right on. When installing the cam alignment plate, it slides right in the exhaust cam but the intake cam needs wiggled with a wrench to slide in(maybe a 1/64 inch). Any thoughts?
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Rod 02-01-2016 10:04
Code is gone after a slight crankshaft sensor adjustment. Thanks ............... ....
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nojodas67 02-01-2016 14:26
Glad you figured it out. You're welcome.
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Christian 02-17-2016 20:44
I have a question that I have not found an answer to yet, I'm putting a fusion engine into my Mazda 6 which is a manual, since I'm doing the swap, I'm going to replace the clutch, I am just not sure which clutch to buy, a Ford Fusion clutch or a Mazda 6? The transmission is still the original Mazda one so I'm assuming a Mazda clutch. Thanks for the help
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Artem Vestsorov 02-18-2016 02:59
You'll want to get a Mazda clutch. When I did this swap I bough a new Mazda clutch and flywheel. Worked out great.
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nojodas67 02-18-2016 03:02
Mazda clutch set is correct.
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Carson 03-03-2016 18:55
Hey guys, my car is still not starting after this swap. Here is a little more info, and I am getting a CEL while cranking for extended periods now.

The car still is not starting. I re checked the timing today and it was off by a little bit so I locked everything back in place and loosened the crank bolt and re positioned the crank pulley to line up the hole in the pulley to the hole in the timing cover. I re-checked everything and it's now in time (ignition timing, I think the valve timing was fine the whole time because I did not have to take the timing chain loose to reset)....but it still wont start, I am not getting spark and from smelling the spark plugs I don't think I am getting fuel either but the fuel pump is turning on. I am finally getting a CEL now after cranking for a little bit. I get code P0335 which is for the crank shaft position sensor, which make since because I know this will kill spark and I am pretty sure it sends the signal to turn on the fuel control ecm. I have replaced the sensor and no change. I tested the electrical connections for the senor with the key turned on and I am getting about 2 volts on one pin and about 2.5v on the other. I am not sure what the reading should be but I know on one of my nissans the sensors get a 5v signal. I have not checked what readings I get while the car is being cranked because I was by myself. Any ideas?
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nojodas67 03-04-2016 04:32
First thing that comes to mind is make sure you double check all the electrical connections, also check all the ground connections, especially the one above the transmission (this one has been missed by a few members here). Also, be sure you are using your Mazda throttle body, not the Fusion part.
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Carson 03-04-2016 14:54
I have re checked my grounds several times, but I will check them again. I am using the whole intake manifold and t/b from the mazda engine.
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Nojodas67 03-26-2016 23:49
Carson: Did you get your car started yet? If so, what was the problem of it not starting?
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Carson 03-27-2016 02:56
Quoting Nojodas67:
Carson: Did you get your car started yet? If so, what was the problem of it not starting?


Nope. I have not had a chance to work on it again. I am throwing the crankshaft sensor code when trying to start the car. I'll post back when I have had a chance to work on it. Any ideas on how to chase this down?
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Carson 04-11-2016 17:32
I re checked the grounds today on the top of the trans. I checked them for continuity to the battery ground and they all tested (I was using the "beep" setting) good. So I probed the two wires that go to the crank sensor (I probed them at the connector next to the fuse box). I checked them one at a time, I put the red lead on the wire from the sensor and the black lead was on the battery ground. Both wires tested the same. They show ~2.54 v when the key is switched on but not cranking. While cranking the initially spike up to ~2.9v and then fall quickly back to ~2.7v. I am not sure what they should read since I don't have a manual for this car. Any help guys?
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nojodas67 04-11-2016 21:14
Have you tried to start the engine with the crank or cam sensor disconnected? individually or together?
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Carson 04-11-2016 22:06
I have not tried starting the car with those sensors unplugged. Should I? What will that show? I will look at the tach next time I get over to the car. I also need to test at the ecu. I know I am getting power at the plug beside the fuse box but I have not tested anything at the ecu. Where is the ecu located in these cars?
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nojodas67 04-12-2016 02:28
With the crank sensor unplugged, the ECU will try to start the engine in safe mode. Have you watched the video? If you have a 2-wire crank sensor, it produces A/C current, not D/C. Bench test your crank sensor with the volt meter set at A/C volt range.
If you get voltage at both cam and crank sensor, then the physical valve timing is probably off just enough so the ECU will not send spark signal to the coil and pulse signals to the injectors.
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nojodas67 04-11-2016 21:18
Does the RPM needle register any rpm while cranking?
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Carson 04-12-2016 01:33
Quoting nojodas67:
Does the RPM needle register any rpm while cranking?

No movement from the tach at all when cranking
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nojodas67 04-12-2016 02:43
If the car ran prior to the swap, then the swap was not done correctly per the instructions. If you did the swap yourself, you need to re-trace your steps. If someone else did the swap, most likely, valve timing is off, as most mechanics tend to take shortcuts or not follow directions to the "t". The valve timing on these engines have to be set exactly or they will not run. I read your original post and I'm more convinced it was not timed properly. "I think the valve timing was fine the whole time because I did not have to take the timing chain loose to reset". The only way to properly set timing on these engines is to loosen the crankshaft bolt AND BOTH cam gears, set the timing tools in place, then tighten everything in proper sequence.
I have posted the Youtube links for the videos for setting timing on these engines properly. I think you need to re-visit them.
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Carson 04-12-2016 13:16
Quoting nojodas67:
If the car ran prior to the swap, then the swap was not done correctly per the instructions. If you did the swap yourself, you need to re-trace your steps. If someone else did the swap, most likely, valve timing is off, as most mechanics tend to take shortcuts or not follow directions to the "t". The valve timing on these engines have to be set exactly or they will not run. I read your original post and I'm more convinced it was not timed properly. "I think the valve timing was fine the whole time because I did not have to take the timing chain loose to reset". The only way to properly set timing on these engines is to loosen the crankshaft bolt AND BOTH cam gears, set the timing tools in place, then tighten everything in proper sequence.
I have posted the Youtube links for the videos for setting timing on these engines properly. I think you need to re-visit them.

I agree with you, something is not right I am just trying to chase it down with the information I have. I did the swap my self and I have not watched the videos you have posted yet. What does the dead tach indicate when cranking?
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nojodas67 04-12-2016 16:09
It has been a while since I did my last swap, but from what I recall, these cars will show tach movement while cranking. (if anyone with a running Mazda6 can confirm, please do so). A dead tach in most cars indicate the crank sensor is not telling the ECU that the engine is rotating and trying to start, therefore, it will not send an ignition signal to the coil or a pulse to the injectors.
Did you try starting the engine with the CPS disconnected yet? If the engine starts, then the problem is with the CPS not sending a signal to the ECU. If it still does not start, then you need to retrace your steps and redo the valve timing.
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nojodas67 04-11-2016 21:38
This is a fairly good video on how to bench test the crank and cam sensors
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvuzZJqQDf4&nohtml5=False
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Dave L. 03-26-2016 15:44
I just want to thank you for this guide,I changed the engine in my daughters 2006 mazda 6 i 5 speed. I used a 2008 fusion engine that had been with automatic trans. By following your guide things went well and the car is up and running with no problems .This fusion swap saved at least $500. I swapped the valve cover,intake and throttle body,crank pulley,crank pulley sensor(new),pil ot bearing (new engine did not have one) and oil pressure sensor (new),also changed the thermostat while it was easy to get at,various new gaskets and belt.
Thanks for sharing your knowledge on this site you really helped me.
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Smithg385 04-10-2016 22:57
Thanks for sharing it kkfdkbkdebggdce k
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Liltee13 04-19-2016 10:21
Hi I'm sure you have covered this many times but I've read so many posts I think it easyr to ask straight out, I have a 2004 Mazda 6 wagon,manual, motor ceased. So have taken out. Can get a cheap second hand motor Mazda 04 motor but it's out of an automatic car. Can I put it in my manual?? Or is there a better option?? What has to be changed?? Hope some one can help me!!
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Artem Vestsorov 04-20-2016 00:35
Yes you can use that motor - the difference between the manual and automatic engines is a pilot bearing which you will need to purchase and install in the automatic engine. You will also have remove the flexplate from the auto engine and install the flywheel from your manual engine.
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Jimmy 06-23-2016 18:04
It may have been covered already and I missed it, Sorry if this is the case
I have a 2006 Mazda 6 with a 2.3 and hard rod knock.
I have a 2007 Mazda 5 as a donor vehicle(complet e, running but body is rotten)
Is it the same as the Mazda 3 in that the oil pan needs to be swapped, or are there more components that also need to be changed?
Thanks in advance
Jimmy
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Tom 06-25-2016 17:27
Looking for wisdom. Swapped an 08 Fusion engine into 06 Mazda6 - so same camshaft. Used the Mazda 6 crankshaft pulley, crank position sensor, and oil pressure sensor. Car runs but often lacks any power - barely able to get the car to move at times, other times it is OK.

My only thought is that somehow the timing is off because the chain moved during the swap. I, and my mechanic, are at a loss about how to further diagnose and fix.

Any suggestions about what we should try? What might have gone wrong? Is it a timing issue?

Thanks.
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nojodas67 06-26-2016 15:36
9 times out of 10, the issue with these engines is incorrect timing.

Watch these short videos, the proper way to set timing tension on these engines is to start with BOTH cam bolts AND crankshaft bolts loose, so that even tension is set in the chain ALL the way around. Once proper chain tension is set by the tensioner alone, then you want to install the timing gear cover and tighten the crank bolt first to proper torque, then tighten the exhaust cam bolt, and finally tighten the intake cam bolt.
You DO have to loosen both cam bolts to get proper tension and proper timing alignment, or it won't run right.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBJ31S2WuaI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4jcoRG2Av0
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Johnptry 06-29-2016 02:03
Hello folks, I'm fairly new to swapping these engines between the fusion and the mazdas. Successfully swapped on 09 fusion into an 05 mazda6 back in January. I am currently having trouble with another swap though, it's an 09 fusion motor going into an 04 mazda3. The engine is in and runs, but keeps showing a random misfire with cylinder #1 counting the highest.

I have been through everything I can think of, reset the timing, smoked the engine for vacuum leaks, swapped coils and injectors around trying to get it to move, checked fuel pressure, adjusted the crank sensor, also tested both crank and cam sensors for resistance. No matter what I do it just keeps misfiring, I am running an intake cleaning with seafoam tomorrow in a last ditch effort. If anyone has any insight that may help me out, I would certainly appreciate hearing about it.

Thanks in advance!

John
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nojodas67 08-01-2016 13:27
Quoting Johnptry:
Hello folks, I'm fairly new to swapping these engines between the fusion and the mazdas. Successfully swapped on 09 fusion into an 05 mazda6 back in January. I am currently having trouble with another swap though, it's an 09 fusion motor going into an 04 mazda3. The engine is in and runs, but keeps showing a random misfire with cylinder #1 counting the highest.

I have been through everything I can think of, reset the timing, smoked the engine for vacuum leaks, swapped coils and injectors around trying to get it to move, checked fuel pressure, adjusted the crank sensor, also tested both crank and cam sensors for resistance. No matter what I do it just keeps misfiring, I am running an intake cleaning with seafoam tomorrow in a last ditch effort. If anyone has any insight that may help me out, I would certainly appreciate hearing about it.

Thanks in advance!

John

Hi John,
I just noticed your post today. Did you ever get this one figured out?

Nojodas67
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Mechanic Matt 07-17-2016 09:25
so i am currently working on a 2005 Mazda 6, and i am installing the 08 millan engine.

both camshafts are stamped with 6258 (intake) 6248 exhaust. therefore there is no question the camshafts are identical. this removes any variables such as the JDM manufactured vehicles. hope this helps someone because it held me up for quite some time.
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tom 08-01-2016 00:18
I swapped an 08 Fusion engine into an 06 Mazda 6. I swapped the crankshaft pulley, crank position sensor, and oil pressure sensor and set the timing (thanks nojodas67) and checked the cams for proper position.

The car runs OK when it first runs, but when restarted the engine will idle but not rev and not generate power. My mechanic friend thinks its the computer ???

Any ideas? How do I diagnose / troubleshoot ?

Thanks.
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nojodas67 08-01-2016 13:24
Quoting tom:
I swapped an 08 Fusion engine into an 06 Mazda 6. I swapped the crankshaft pulley, crank position sensor, and oil pressure sensor and set the timing (thanks nojodas67) and checked the cams for proper position.

The car runs OK when it first runs, but when restarted the engine will idle but not rev and not generate power. My mechanic friend thinks its the computer ???

Any ideas? How do I diagnose / troubleshoot ?

Thanks.


I have never come across this: "it runs ok when first started but will not run well when restarted"
What do you mean exactly? Do you start it in the morning, then it runs and drives it ok until you turn it off... but later in the day you re-start it but it then runs like crap? I have never seen or experienced that and so I don't know what to tell you.

There are too many unanswered question and we would need more history in order to try and help you; such as: Did you own the car before the original engine blew up? How did it run then? Any DTC's present prior AND after the swap? Any DTC's being set now?

What parts (complete list) did you swap? In your original post, there was no mention of the throttle body, intake manifold, and many other parts outlined in this guide. (which one is still in the car, Mazda or Fusion part?).
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tom 08-26-2016 14:33
We owned the car for 50K miles - car and original engine had 162K upon failure. Car ran fine until engine blew. My son drives the car.

We double checked all the components you mentioned - throttle body etc - all Mazda. We also checked that the crank pulley and crank position sensor are Mazda. The 08 Fusion engine has six prong exhaust cam as did the 06 original Mazda engine. We are using the timing tool set (2 pins and one plate) to reset the timing as a last double check. (long bolt first with crankshaft at TDC, then short bolt thru crank pulley, then loosen cam bolts and then insert flat plate on cam slots, then check chain for uniform tension, then tighten crank and cam bolts - Right?)

We'll then start it and scan for codes. I'm crossing my fingers as I am out of ideas if this does not work. I'll report here on DTCs if it produces any after the retiming.

Really appreciate the forum and helpful comments.
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JohnMazda3&6 08-14-2016 21:10
Hi all. Just finished reading this entire guide right down to the last post. So much useful and confidence inspiring info.

I own three Mazda's 2003 6 2.3L, 2005 3 2.3L, and 2006 6 3.0L.

I recently bought the 2005 3 2.3L with 150kmi. It has the notorious start up rattle from the VVT and also consumes a lot of oil (no smoke on startup or running, no leaks) however it runs well.

My question is, Does a defective VVT contribute to oil consumption?

I've heard this referred to on the Mazda3 forums but don't see the correlation. I'm willing to replace the VVT gear, chain, tensioner etc, but if the oil consumption is from ring wear etc, I'll save my money for a swap.

Thanks!
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Eric 01-13-2017 06:58
Quoting JohnMazda3&6:
Hi all. Just finished reading this entire guide right down to the last post. So much useful and confidence inspiring info.

I own three Mazda's 2003 6 2.3L, 2005 3 2.3L, and 2006 6 3.0L.

I recently bought the 2005 3 2.3L with 150kmi. It has the notorious start up rattle from the VVT and also consumes a lot of oil (no smoke on startup or running, no leaks) however it runs well.

My question is, Does a defective VVT contribute to oil consumption?

I've heard this referred to on the Mazda3 forums but don't see the correlation. I'm willing to replace the VVT gear, chain, tensioner etc, but if the oil consumption is from ring wear etc, I'll save my money for a swap.

Thanks!

My car had the rattle upon starting the car and burned about a quart a week. I thought it was the VVT or something to do with the tensioner but it was one my piston rings. Maybe do a compression test? I didn't do it until my car lost almost all its power and found out one of my cylinders only had about 50 psi.
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Carson 08-26-2016 14:59
I have posted here several times and have not had time to work on the car again. I am pulling the engine again to make sure the timing is set correctly. Does anyone have a link or copies of the fsm on setting the timing on this engine? I think I had it correct but I also never loosened the exhaust cam bolt when setting the timing so I am not 100% sure. Thanks for any help.
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Carson 10-03-2016 18:50
Hey guys,
I took the engine back out and pulled the timing cover and reset the timing after loosening both cam bolts. The timing appeared to be spot on before I reset it, but I did it anyway just to rule it out. I put everything back together and I am still getting the no start condition. It just cranks and does not try. I am not getting spark, and the injectors are not pulsing but I do have fuel pressure at the fuel rail. If I crank the car long enough it throws the P0335 (cam sensor) code. I have replaced the cam sensor and still no change. Any help guys? I really need this car running.
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nojodas67 10-03-2016 21:45
Silly question, and I sincerely hope this is your problem. Have you checked all the fuses in the fuse box. A few years ago, I was chasing a no-start condition after a Fusion swap.

It turns out somehow during the swap, the fuse for the ECM had popped. Of course, I wasted several hours re-tracing ALL my steps of the swap several times; out of sheer desperation, I started to check the fuses and to my surprise, the ECM (I think labeled as IGN) was bad. I replaced it with another one and it fired right up.
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Carson 10-03-2016 23:32
I wish that's what it is. I have checked them all several times. I'll check again, but I really don't think that is it. Did you see the thread I started on the Mazda 6 forum? There are a few pictures there. There are a few questionable pins on the big plug that plug in next to the fuse block. Also I cranked the car with the crank sensor unplugged and there was no change. I tried cranking it with the cam sensor in plugged and there was no change. Not sure what I did to take a running car pre engine swap into a non starting car. It's pretty frustrating. I have done a bunch of engine swaps and never had this much trouble. The coil is getting the 12volt signal with the car switched on but no spark.
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nojodas67 10-04-2016 13:55
I'm afraid I'm out of ideas, except that you may have an open circuit somewhere...the ecu is not communicating with the crank sensor, coil pack or the injectors. I would check continuity in all these circuits first, if you've already exhausted all the other possibilities. Trace the wires for the crank sensor first and check for an open or short from the sensor to ECU.
Sorry to hear about your troubles.
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Carson 10-04-2016 14:11
Do you have a pin out for the ECU? I don't have the FSM. I can trace the wires back to the connector that plugs in by the engine bay fuse box, but I need to see if the signal is making it back to the ecu. Is the fuel injection and spark handled by something other than the ecu? Is there another module I need to look at? And just to make sure...there are only two fuse boxes in the car correct? One under the hood on the left side and then the one in the driver side kick panel?
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Carson 10-06-2016 14:26
Do know what readings I should show on the two pins for the crank sensor at the ecu when the vehicle is being cranked?
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Carson 10-13-2016 20:17
If the ecu is getting power, what would cause me to not be getting spark, and the injectors are not firing either when the engine is cranked? There is also 12v present at the coil with the ignition switched on.
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nojodas67 10-14-2016 01:18
I have run into similar situations where a faulty temp sensor keeps the ECU from telling the coil to spark and keeps the injectors from delivering fuel. This has happened to me on Saturn and Fords. An out-of-range temperature is a safety feature in most cars to avoid engine damage.
First test the crank sensor like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LaTEPhB1_C8

After you've verified that the ECU senses that the engine is spinning (registering rpm's ) when the engine is turning over by the starter, as you turn the key....Then watch this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1L4nB2NdA0U
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Carson 10-14-2016 14:01
I assume you are talking about the coolant temp sensor? I could probably check what temp it is showing with an OBDII scanner with that feature.

Thanks for the links I will check them out and see what results I get.
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Carson 10-31-2016 17:50
I cranked the engine over today, I am getting no tach movement at all while cranking.
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nojodas67 11-01-2016 00:35
The ECU definitely has no idea that you're trying to start the car when you turn the key.

Did you ever test the coolant temp sensor? Do you get correct readings from the temp sensor with an OBDII scanner?
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Jeff 09-08-2016 01:06
Hey fellas thanks for the write up and all comments. I recently swapped out my '06 Mazda 6 2.3l for a Ford 2.5l out of a 2011 Ford Escape. Worked like a charm super easy. (I'm a roofer lol)
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nojodas67 09-08-2016 13:37
Quoting Jeff:
Hey fellas thanks for the write up and all comments. I recently swapped out my '06 Mazda 6 2.3l for a Ford 2.5l out of a 2011 Ford Escape. Worked like a charm super easy. (I'm a roofer lol)

Glad it worked out. Just goes to show... if you follow the guide and instructions exactly, it will work.
Thanks for posting your results.
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tom 09-08-2016 17:03
I swapped an 08 Fusion 2.3 engine into an 06 Mazda 6. Car would run fine initially but then barely run after about 30 minutes. Thought is was timing - so redid timing with proper tool kit and checked everything.

Had the car diagnosed - found out it was the catalytic converter. For any of you with similar problem, a new cat converter may be your solution.

Appreciate the forum. Hope this helps someone.
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nojodas67 09-08-2016 19:03
Thanks for following up on this. Although I've heard of many cases where the cat was so plugged up that the engine would not run or run poorly due to a large restriction in the exhaust, I didn't suggest looking into that because the car was supposedly running ok prior to the swap.
Early to mid 2000's Nissan 2.5L engines, had cats with ceramic medium material (instead of platinum) that would deteriorate prematurely at around 50k miles. The cats were part of the exhaust manifold in proximity to the exhaust valves, so upon deceleration, the ceramic powder would get sucked into the cylinders and grind the cylinder walls to a larger size, thus at around 50-80k miles, these engines would lose compression rapidly, shortly after the cat began to deteriorate. Nissan refused to offer any type of relief for owners and so just like the thousands of failed Mazda 6's, I also rebuilt many Nissan Sentra and Altima 2.5L engines, because of this other catastrophic design flaw.
Manufacturers should do better testing before rolling out a new product to the market, rather than having the consumer do the testing for them.
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Tobi Billups 09-08-2016 23:55
My children were looking for NYC DoF NYC-3L a few days ago and discovered a web service that hosts an online forms library . If others need NYC DoF NYC-3L too , here's http://goo.gl/Z0zO4A.
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tom 09-28-2016 18:18
An update on Mazda 6 saga - swapped 08 Fusion 2.3 into 06 Mazda 6 5 speed . We had the car diagnosed at the local Mazda dealer - and the catalytic converter code was determined to be primary culprit. As a plugged cat converter could explain why the car would run without power once it got hot, I had an aftermarket converter installed by a reputable shop that checked the O2 sensor (seemed OK) and cleared the codes.

We still have the same problem. The car runs fine upon cold start and for about half an hour. Once the hot engine is shut off and started again, it runs, but provides no power. I replaced the cam position sensor. No better. Have not yet tried replacement of throttle position sensor or crankshaft position sensor. Not sure that it would help.

My thinking now is that it may be the ECU. That somehow it got damaged. This is my son's car and he needs it for work. We are running out of patience, time, and not thrilled about putting any more money into car without knowing if it will help.

Most interested in your ideas about what to do. Thanks
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Rene 10-04-2016 15:30
This might sound stupid but
How do I know which engine to buy?
Oval VVT 2.5
Or Rectangle VVT 2.5
Help please.
Thank you in advance!.
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Craig Petith 10-05-2016 04:19
Not sure if the question was posed above, but can you remove the 2.3 motor from a 2006 Fusion from the top like you did the Mazda? Have a seized motor I need to swap out, and can't do it from below. I'm guessing yes, but would prefer something better than a guess. Thanks
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nojodas67 10-05-2016 13:10
I've never had to remove an engine from a Fusion so I couldn't tell you for sure.

.
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Craig Petith 10-05-2016 14:10
Thanks.... anyone else?
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Rene 10-05-2016 14:13
Whould any 2.5 from a fusion would work?.
Help plz.
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TERRY ROARK 11-11-2016 05:09
I have a Question. I have been reading the articles and I have a 05 mazda 6 with a 2.3. so you can replace it with a 2.3 ford fusion what year. and can you replace the transmission to.
thank you for any information.
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nojodas67 11-11-2016 14:05
Quoting TERRY ROARK:
I have a Question. I have been reading the articles and I have a 05 mazda 6 with a 2.3. so you can replace it with a 2.3 ford fusion what year. and can you replace the transmission to.
thank you for any information.

You can use any Ford Fusion 2.3L or Ford Focus 2.3L (Not 2.0L) 2006 or newer. I currently have two low-mileage (30-40k) focus engines on the shelf that I can sell to anyone interested. $500 each plus shipping ($150) or free pickup.
I've never had to replace a transmission so I couldn't tell you for sure on that.

Thanks.
John
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mocha sumo 11-25-2016 07:34
Thought-provoki ng comments - I learned a lot from the insight , Does anyone know if my company could possibly get ahold of a template Bankruptcy B6I document to work with ?
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JohnMazda3&6 12-11-2016 01:11
Just finished a 2011 2.5 Fusion swap into my '05 Mazda 3. Swapped the timing wheel from the 2.3 over to the 2.5 intake cam. Installation and alignment done by co-worker machinist.

Car starts fine but idles rough for a bit but eventually stabilizes. Problem is that there is no power. Engine load at idle shows ~30%! Pressing the gas pedal to the floor does nothing! For the week I've been messing with it I've gotten the cam sensor code once or twice.

I've been over every sensor and connector in the engine bay. Everything else is working perfectly. But no power to the point that the car can't be driven.

Any body else seen this?

Thanks.
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JohnMazda3&6 12-11-2016 01:21
Nevermind, looking over the comments, it's apparent that it's clearly a timing issue.
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JohnMazda3&6 12-11-2016 01:26
"Once proper chain tension is set by the tensioner alone, then you want to install the timing gear cover and tighten the crank bolt first to proper torque, then tighten the exhaust cam bolt, and finally tighten the intake cam bolt."

But, once you put the cover on, you can't torque the bolts because the cover is in the way!
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Mike 12-11-2016 16:39
Ok guys, one thing I have noticed, alot of guys are forgetting about the fact that the intake ports are bigger on the 2.5 than the 2.3. You can not use the 2.5 intake with out using a adapter to use your original 2.3 throttle body, which I do now know a place to get them.
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Smithg295 12-19-2016 11:03
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tomboozer 01-02-2017 20:38
One last try. Swapped an 08 Fusion 2.3 engine into a 06 Mazda 6 5 speed. Kept original ECU. Triple checked timing - seems correct. This Mazda with Fusion engine runs great for first 30 minutes. Then it will run but produce no power. Took to Mazda dealer for diagnosis - their codes showed catalytic converter - so we replaced it with aftermarket converter designed for the car. No change - same problem. Next, we took it to independent shop with diagnostic tools. Had mechanic check for grounding shorts and perform diagnostic with their computer tools. Codes say that ECU is incompatible - that ECU is from automatic car - even though the ECU is original. Called ECU remanufacturer - their thought was that ECU needs to be programmed for Fusion engine??? Could it be that the ECU was damaged during the swap? Do I spend another $200 + for remanufactured and programmed ECU or will I just be wasting (more) money?

I ask for your help here. We now have $2.5K in the repair and the damn car doesn't work:(((((

Thanks
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nojodas67 01-03-2017 22:31
Was this a car that you owned for a while and ran good, then engine threw a rod? Or was this a recent purchase prior to the swap? If the latter, then I would say that an ECU replacement would be worth a try, if you don't know the history of the car. If the former is true, I highly doubt the ECU got damaged during the swap. I have done many of these swaps and never had to re-program a Mazda ECU to accept a Fusion engine.
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JohnC 01-04-2017 00:15
"Once proper chain tension is set by the tensioner alone, then you want to install the timing gear cover and tighten the crank bolt first to proper torque, then tighten the exhaust cam bolt, and finally tighten the intake cam bolt."

But, once you put the cover on, you can't torque the bolts because the cover is in the way!

I just did this swap which did not work. So, Am I wrong about not being able to tighten the cam bolts once the timing cover is in the way?
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JohnC 01-04-2017 00:21
Furthermore, in the video links posted by Nojodas which are said to be the absolute most correct way to do the timing, the guy in the video is shown tightening the cam bolts with the timing cover off !!

So, What IS the right way to do it?
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nojodas67 01-04-2017 15:02
You can do it either way. However, because Ford decided to not include a keyed crankshaft gear and keyed camshafts, in order to save 50 cents per engine, then you need to purchase special tools to set the timing on these POS engines. BTW: Since Mazda is no longer influenced by Ford, they have gone back to keyed crank and cam gears after their divorce from F.O.R.D.

For absolute proper timing, it has to be done with the cover on or with the cover off but with proper camshaft AND crankshaft locking tools such as these: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Engine-Timing-Tool-Kit-Camshaft-Flywheel-Locking-Tools-For-Ford-Mazda-/291982820520?hash=item43fb8844a8:g:yToAAOSwEzxYYMZ8&item=291982820520&vxp=mtr
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nojodas67 01-04-2017 15:03
For "close-enough" timing, you can do it with the cover off, but again you need the proper tools and follow the proper procedures very carefully. These are NOT your normal fail-safe "keyed" engines.

This guy made his own custom wrench in order to tighten the intake cam bolt with the cover on. Mazda sells a special tool that works in a similar way but it's expensive and probably not worthwhile for one-time use. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLU3nQNRaO4


Lastly, it has been a couple years since I worked on one of these POS engines, but every swap I did worked and the cars ran well; there have also been many posts on this site by other users that share the same outcome, so the instructions posted in this guide (which I did not start) do work, but they have to be followed closely. I don't frequent this site much anymore, but whenever I can, I will continue to contribute and answer questions from time to time.
John
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Dave M 01-30-2017 15:06
I have a 2006 Mazda Tribute 2.3 AWD with a spun rod bearing. I found a donor motor out of a 2007 Mazda 6 (2.3 of course). Do you know if these are compatible? I'm a retired ASE master tech so whatever swapping needs to be done is not an issue.. Thanks for your knowledge.
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nojodas67 01-30-2017 17:59
I believe Tribute and Escape 2.3's are NON-VVT. I've swapped Focus 2.3L's (Fusion are VVT, Focus = non-VVT) into two or three Tributes, in my 2.3L engine-swapping days. Your donor Mazda6 engine will work, you just won't have an electrical connector for the VVT actuator, and I believe the plastic engine cover from the Tribute (insulator) will cover the non-functioning VVT actuator anyway, if that is an aesthetic issue for you. Other than that, it will work just fine.

That 2.3L will be a b*tch to get out of an AWD chasis. I've taken them all out of the top, but on an AWD, you'll have to drop the subframe and drop the whole assembly (motor/trans/tr ansfer case) out the bottom.

Good luck.
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nojodas67 01-30-2017 18:04
What I would do is sell that Mazda6 engine since they fetch around $1200-1500 and just buy a Focus 2.3L which you can pick up anywhere for around $400-500. Up to you.

However, which ever engine you plan on using (Mazda6 or Focus), make sure the crankshaft pulley is the same. I believe the Mazda6 uses a different crankshaft timing wheel than the Tribute. I can't remember now.
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Dave M 01-30-2017 18:27
Thanks for the info. I actually found a Focus 2.3 and having it delivered today. I'm a step ahead as far as flipping that Mazda 6 motor..I'm taking that too as it was only $500 w 70K on the odometer..Car was a rollover

I actually pulled the motor already. Instead of dropping the entire powertrain, I disconnected the transfer and just pulled it out a couple of inches w shaft intact and pulled the motor from the top.

Hopefully that little bit of info will help someone in the future. I really appreciate your experience and sharing it.
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nojodas67 01-30-2017 22:20
You're welcome. Glad I could be of help.
Good luck on the swap and let us know how it goes.

Be sure to follow the procedure very closely to time the engine. I don't remember if the intake camshaft has to be swapped or not on a Focus engine, you'll have to make that determination once you take the valve cover off and count the cogs on the cam gear.

Now that I'm thinking more about those Tribute/Focus swaps. On one of the Tributes I fixed, I couldn't find a decent 2.3L focus engine, but I had found a 2.0L with just 5,000 miles on it from a wrecked donor, so I tried it and it worked great too. My sister still has that car which has over 100k miles now, and as a bonus it gets better gas mileage than before the swap! :)
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Mike 02-01-2017 02:23
Just swapped out an 09 fusion in my 06 mazda 6. followed guide exactly. Car starts, idles and revs good while in park but looses almost all power when placed in drive. Timing is set
and rechecked. No cel and get no codes. ordered a new throttle body but haven't received it yet. Please help as we are out of ideas and with no codes don't know where to go.
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nojodas67 02-01-2017 05:59
What exactly are the symptoms? What does "looses almost all power when placed in drive" mean?

As you shift to drive, does engine stall? Is there any throttle response?
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Mike 02-02-2017 00:14
Quoting nojodas67:
What exactly are the symptoms? What does "looses almost all power when placed in drive" mean?

As you shift to drive, does engine stall? Is there any throttle response?


I have a mechanic working on the car. I provided the instructions and was present for the swap. All instructions were followed and he rechecked cam and reset timing as outlined in the post. The engine turns over, idles and revs fine while in park. When you put the car in gear it doesn't stall but has no or a barely noticeable response to the throttle. In drive or reverse No codes no cel.
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JohnC 02-01-2017 02:33
Exactly how did you "recheck" the timing?
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Mike 02-02-2017 02:14
We went through the steps as outlined in the post again. Engine idles and revs perfectly in park. Place I gear it doesn't stall still runs, no misses, etc but will not accelerate. I understood mazda had throttle body problems and with genocide or cel sent for a new throttle body but haven't received it yet. Seems Similar to the problem encountered by Tom. I never saw a resolution to his power problems. Any ideas?
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JohnC 02-02-2017 03:16
Quoting Mike:
We went through the steps as outlined in the post again. Engine idles and revs perfectly in park. Place I gear it doesn't stall still runs, no misses, etc but will not accelerate. I understood mazda had throttle body problems and with genocide or cel sent for a new throttle body but haven't received it yet. Seems Similar to the problem encountered by Tom. I never saw a resolution to his power problems. Any ideas?

I tried to help you. I had the exact same problem as you! But since you can't answer a simple question, you're on your own. Good luck!
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Mike 02-02-2017 14:22
Quoting Mike:
We went through the steps as outlined in the post again. Engine idles and revs perfectly in park. Place I gear it doesn't stall still runs, no misses, etc but will not accelerate. I understood mazda had throttle body problems and with genocide or cel sent for a new throttle body but haven't received it yet. Seems Similar to the problem encountered by Tom. I never saw a resolution to his power problems. Any ideas?

I meant no codes and no cel
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JohnC 02-02-2017 02:04
Again, I'll ask you, EXACTLY, How did you "recheck" the timing? It matters.
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Mike 02-02-2017 17:31
Quoting tom:
An update on Mazda 6 saga - swapped 08 Fusion 2.3 into 06 Mazda 6 5 speed . We had the car diagnosed at the local Mazda dealer - and the catalytic converter code was determined to be primary culprit. As a plugged cat converter could explain why the car would run without power once it got hot, I had an aftermarket converter installed by a reputable shop that checked the O2 sensor (seemed OK) and cleared the codes.

We still have the same problem. The car runs fine upon cold start and for about half an hour. Once the hot engine is shut off and started again, it runs, but provides no power. I replaced the cam position sensor. No better. Have not yet tried replacement of throttle position sensor or crankshaft position sensor. Not sure that it would help.

My thinking now is that it may be the ECU. That somehow it got damaged. This is my son's car and he needs it for work. We are running out of patience, time, and not thrilled about putting any more money into car without knowing if it will help.
Thanks

Tom, having a problem similar to yours. Did you ever resolve the power problem? Quoting JohnC:
Again, I'll ask you, EXACTLY, How did you "recheck" the timing? It matters.

Thanks John, we will go through the timing procedure again. followed the procedure twice, cogs, position, etc. Was there a particular aspect that caused the problem? I appreciate your help and your insight on this matter.
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nojodas67 02-03-2017 00:42
Quoting Mike:
Quoting tom:

We still have the same problem. The car runs fine upon cold start and for about half an hour. Once the hot engine is shut off and started again, it runs, but provides no power. I replaced the cam position sensor. No better. Have not yet tried replacement of throttle position sensor or crankshaft position sensor. Not sure that it would help.

Tom, having a problem similar to yours. Did you ever resolve the power problem? Quoting JohnC:
Again, I'll ask you, EXACTLY, How did you "recheck" the timing? It matters.

Thanks John, we will go through the timing procedure again. followed the procedure twice, cogs, position, etc. Was there a particular aspect that caused the problem? I appreciate your help and your insight on this matter.

I believe Tom and Mike, although having similar symptoms, are different issues altogether. Tom's car drives fine until it warms up. Mike's car doesn't drive at all, cold or hot. Mike's issue is most likely: mechanical timing is off a little, Tom's issue is most likely: an electronic issue triggered by engine temp.
It was very common for old Fords (90's and early 2000's) to quit running once the engine warmed up; then after the car sat for a while and cooled down, the engine started up again. It turned out to be the ignition control modules 99% of the time.
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JohnC 02-03-2017 16:47
The aspect that can cause the problem is that cam and pulley timing can be good but the crank can be off! You can't take any shortcuts or make assumptions. For example, you can't just put the cam plate in and look at the pulley and say it's in time. You must verify #1 TDC compression and work from there out to the cam plate and then the pulley timing.

Ideally, you'd use the timing peg (hopefully you have the right one) through the block. I used both the timing peg and a rod in the #1 cylinder at the same time as secondary verification. It really helped.

You must verify all three aspects, TDC, Cam, and Pulley.

Now, I'm NOT saying that timing is the answer, or that I have an answer, to your particular problem. What I am saying that given the importance of timing on these, eliminating it as a variable is of the utmost importance. That is why I've been asking you guys to be very specific about how you did it. I'm offering some encouragement based on my experience. I'm just a DIY'er and not a pro by any means.
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nojodas67 02-03-2017 20:08
Exactly like JohnC said, which I've repeated for years now; You CANNOT take any shortcuts when timing these engines and you CANNOT do it without the proper tools...or you will just be wasting your time for sure.
If you are doing it yourself, or if a buddy or mechanic is doing it for you, you better pick up a set of proper timing tools on Ebay specific for this engine (I've posted many links for this took kit in the past)...or just don't do it at all.
And don't think for a second, just because you hire a mechanic, or professional shop to do it, that it will be done correctly, as many here have found out the hard way, right JohnC? There are very very few professionals that know how to time these engines.
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JohnC 02-06-2017 13:16
Quoting nojodas67:
Exactly like JohnC said, which I've repeated for years now; You CANNOT take any shortcuts when timing these engines and you CANNOT do it without the proper tools...or you will just be wasting your time for sure.
If you are doing it yourself, or if a buddy or mechanic is doing it for you, you better pick up a set of proper timing tools on Ebay specific for this engine (I've posted many links for this took kit in the past)...or just don't do it at all.
And don't think for a second, just because you hire a mechanic, or professional shop to do it, that it will be done correctly, as many here have found out the hard way, right JohnC? There are very very few professionals that know how to time these engines.
Absolutely correct. I've had numerous discussions about this lately with people on various forums, YouTube channels, and personally. I can tell you that when you mention to people - I'm talking professional mechanics here - that these engines have keyless crankshafts they will just look at you in disbelief. I can safely say that virtually none of them have even seen, let alone timed, one of these engines.
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nojodas67 02-02-2017 04:27
JohnC,

I'm also now curious...how did you solve the same problem you had?
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JohnC 02-02-2017 06:26
Quoting nojodas67:
JohnC,

I'm also now curious...how did you solve the same problem you had?

You Sir, know better than anyone here. You have correctly (one or two minor exceptions) said it over and over. I set the timing properly! I had paid someone to do it for me before putting the 2.5 in the car. I spent weeks chasing problems that didn't exist since I thought he had done it properly but he didn't, he screwed it up. It wasn't off by much but enough to cause the car to be un-driveable. NO POWER! Scan data showed Engine Load to be 35% at idle and 50% when in gear! Manifold vacuum around 9inHg. After resetting the pulley timing myself the car ran perfectly and has ever since.
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nojodas67 02-02-2017 14:41
Quoting JohnC:
Quoting nojodas67:
JohnC,

I'm also now curious...how did you solve the same problem you had?

You Sir, know better than anyone here. You have correctly (one or two minor exceptions) said it over and over. I set the timing properly! I had paid someone to do it for me before putting the 2.5 in the car. I spent weeks chasing problems that didn't exist since I thought he had done it properly but he didn't, he screwed it up. It wasn't off by much but enough to cause the car to be un-driveable. NO POWER! Scan data showed Engine Load to be 35% at idle and 50% when in gear! Manifold vacuum around 9inHg. After resetting the pulley timing myself the car ran perfectly and has ever since.

JohnC,
Thank you for your comment. It's nice to be recognized. Although I'm not the originator of this site, I try to help and respond to questions as much as I can, although everything anyone could ever want to know about these engines has already been discussed here, several times over. Until I found this site, I mostly had only worked on old-school engines such as pushrod big-blocks and small-block 350's. These modern engines were completely foreign to me just a few years ago, but I guess we're never too old to learn. I still strongly believe that Ford's decision to forego a keyed crank and cam pulleys was totally asinine, which Mazda has now abandoned.
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JohnC 02-03-2017 16:50
You're very kind to offer your time to help people. It's not easy or everyone would be doing it! I agree, this keyless crankshaft thing is just crazy, glad to see it gone.
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nojodas67 02-03-2017 20:03
Well, key-less crank and cam gears are gone on Mazda starting with 2014 model year, but I'm not sure about F.O.R.D. since I have not researched or done any work on them lately, and don't care to . But I also don't agree with their new "Ecoboost" concept lately of putting in tiny engines in big vehicles and boosting the intake pressure to get more power out of them. It's been proven ALWAYS that a turbo-charged or supercharged engine's life expectancy is much shorter than a regular aspirated engine because of the increased amount of work the engine has to do to keep up with the power demand.
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JohnC 02-02-2017 06:31
Quoting nojodas67:
JohnC,

I'm also now curious...how did you solve the same problem you had?

Oh, and by the way, before I figured out that the timing was off, scan data showed that the base timing was perfect! No codes, even though the crankshaft was off from TDC and out of time with camshaft events. Tricky devils these keyless crankshaft engines!
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Tmw0715 02-02-2017 16:47
I am really hoping for some insight on this!! I have a 2007 Mazda 6 3.0 I'm looking to replace the engine in. Is there a Ford option for this year?
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nojodas67 02-03-2017 00:22
Quoting Tmw0715:
I am really hoping for some insight on this!! I have a 2007 Mazda 6 3.0 I'm looking to replace the engine in. Is there a Ford option for this year?

This site only refers to the 2.3L. But Yes, I believe the Ford 3.0 is the same engine. I saw a couple of write-ups on the 3.0L Taurus to Mazda swap. You'll have to search in the Mazda6 forums.
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nojodas67 02-03-2017 00:52
For Tmw0715,
here you go:
http://www.6crew.com/forum/showthread.php?24699-2006-Mazda-3-0L-to-2006-Fusion-3-0L-Swap
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Tmw0715 02-07-2017 02:52
I am only finding information on Mazda 6 year model 2006 and and prior.
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Mike 02-03-2017 18:48
I believe Tom and Mike, although having similar symptoms, are different issues altogether. Tom's car drives fine until it warms up. Mike's car doesn't drive at all, cold or hot. Mike's issue is most likely: mechanical timing is off a little, Tom's issue is most likely: an electronic issue triggered by engine temp.
It was very common for old Fords (90's and early 2000's) to quit running once the engine warmed up; then after the car sat for a while and cooled down, the engine started up again. It turned out to be the ignition control modules 99% of the time.
Thanks, for the insight. I am out of town for a bit but will go through the timing procedure again. I will let you know how it goes. I appreciate your time and this post. It's an excellent source of info.
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nojodas67 02-03-2017 20:11
Again, you cannot skip any steps and you must have the proper timing tools.
Watch the youtube videos I posted here as well. All gears, cams and crank gears must be loosened up and free to rotate in order to achieve proper chain tension. Again, it's all in the videos and in the many posts above.
Good luck.
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JohnC 02-06-2017 13:20
Quoting nojodas67:
Again, you cannot skip any steps and you must have the proper timing tools. Watch the youtube videos I posted here as well. All gears, cams and crank gears must be loosened up and free to rotate in order to achieve proper chain tension. Again, it's all in the videos and in the many posts above.
Good luck.
For what it's worth, I have two videos on YT regarding timing on my 2.5. One is of me verifying timing and finding that it was off. The other is of me going through the process of setting the crank pulley timing. I am also in the process of making detailed videos on how to time the 2.0/2.3/2.5's. As of right now, none seem to exist. I'll post links soon. Till then, you may try searching YT for; 2005 Mazda 3 2.3 to 2.5 Engine Swap.
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Mike 02-17-2017 20:43
I probably should have described the problem as a lack of throttle response. Mazda seems to have problems with throttle bodies on these engines as well. We replaced throttle body and it's running great! Thanks for your and John's help. It's a great resource and a definite money saver doing the swap.
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johnc 02-17-2017 23:20
Quoting Mike:
I probably should have described the problem as a lack of throttle response. Mazda seems to have problems with throttle bodies on these engines as well. We replaced throttle body and it's running great! Thanks for your and John's help. It's a great resource and a definite money saver doing the swap.

Fantastic news! Congratulations . Have not heard about any widespread TB problems, but glad you got it going.
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nojodas67 02-18-2017 04:26
Quoting Mike:
I probably should have described the problem as a lack of throttle response. Mazda seems to have problems with throttle bodies on these engines as well. We replaced throttle body and it's running great! Thanks for your and John's help. It's a great resource and a definite money saver doing the swap.

That's great. And thank you for reporting back to us. Maybe someone else will have a similar issue and your post will definitely help.
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Johnny 02-09-2017 08:09
I have a 1994 ford Ranger Manual 5 speed 2.3 . I was told a 2.3 from a 2003 Ford Fusion will not fit? Is this true?
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johnc 02-17-2017 23:18
Don't know. Call the guys below for more info. Let us know what they say.

http://www.mazdaengines.net/
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Brad Bunker 02-17-2017 18:46
Whats the difference in the 8th vin digit being a C on 1 2.3 and the 8th digit being a Z on a 2.3....The C came out of the 06 Mazda6 2.3 4 cyl.
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johnc 02-17-2017 23:13
Quoting Brad Bunker:
Whats the difference in the 8th vin digit being a C on 1 2.3 and the 8th digit being a Z on a 2.3....The C came out of the 06 Mazda6 2.3 4 cyl.

This is the only Z code engine info that I could find. Hope it helps. If not call them for more info and then let us know what you find out.

http://www.mazdaengines.net/engines/mazda-tribute-used-engines.php
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HeveyC. 02-19-2017 01:20
Thank you for all your info on this page! Just finished putting a 2008 Fusion 2.3 in my 2004 Mazda 3 2.3 manual 5 speed! Couldn't have done it without this link! Runs perfect and hope to get it back on the road this week (gotta get it passed by the California smog nazi's 1st, lol).
Thanks, Curt
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nojodas67 02-19-2017 15:44
Great. Another success story. I'm glad it worked out.

If you could state some comments and observations on the procedure you followed that would be great. Perhaps you could also contribute a few tips to make this guide even better.

Nojodas67
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HeveyC. 02-20-2017 00:59
Joel Rodriguez posts on here saved me a lot of headaches! He had a 04 Mazda 3 like me and switched out a 09 Fusion 2.3. Only difference is my 2.3 is an 08. I read each of his posts on here and they were a huge help for what I was about to take on. It saved me a ton of time too! If you have a Mazda 3 make sure you read all of Joel Rodriguez posts and it should be smooth switch for you too!!
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Billy 02-22-2017 01:25

Does anyone know if a 2011 2.5 fusion engine will work swap out ok with my 2006 Mazda 3 2.3? Curious because I found a good deal on a 2011 2.5 but by judging by the pictures of it some of the pulleys are looking like they are in different spots and may even get in the way of making the engine fit. Also it looks like the ac compressor wouldn't fit right either. Any insight would help! Thx
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johnc 02-22-2017 02:00
Quoting Billy:

Does anyone know if a 2011 2.5 fusion engine will work swap out ok with my 2006 Mazda 3 2.3? Curious because I found a good deal on a 2011 2.5 but by judging by the pictures of it some of the pulleys are looking like they are in different spots and may even get in the way of making the engine fit. Also it looks like the ac compressor wouldn't fit right either. Any insight would help! Thx

Search YouTube for my videos on the swap. I put a 2011 Fusion 2.5 in my 05 Mazda 3. Search: 2005 mazda 3 2.3 to 2.5 engine swap. Look for the Details, Blah, Blah video I made for more info. On your 06, it's easier since you won't have to swap the intake camshaft or timing wheel. Still a good bit of work involved though. Also, go to Mazda3Forums.co m and search for the 2 threads dedicated to the 2.5 swap. All the info you need is there. Good luck!
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Billy 02-22-2017 02:51
hank you John! Already started pulling things apart. I will check out the videos and I have stumbled across those Mazda forum threads! I will update and let everyone know how it goes.
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Billy 03-11-2017 20:30
ell swap is done and the car is running great! It wasn't as tough with the 2006 Mazda 3 but it sure was plenty of work! I scored a 2011 2.5 Fusion motor with 27k miles on it for $500. I didn't need to do anything with the cams or timing cover. Had to swap the oil and pan so my AC would mount up and everything else that this guide covers. The car started almost immediately(had a dead battery at first so had to wait for that to charge up) and runs very smooth. Put 10 miles on it and no cels! thx to everyone on this forum I read all of the posts here and on the Mazda 3 forums. Be sure that if you are going to attempt this you check out the Mazda forum to show how to make the intake manifold work without buying that overpriced adapter.
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Nojodas67 03-12-2017 01:52
That's great. I'm glad it worked out. Thanks for the update and tips on your swap.
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johnc 03-13-2017 02:22
So, you used the Fusion timing cover and the Mazda crankshaft pulley so your A/C belt would go on, Right? Also, Did you keep the 2.5 intake manifold and injectors?
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johnc 03-16-2017 13:10
Hey guys, for some reason I get notifications via email but when I come to this site I can't see them!

I saw that Eric is struggling with the timing. I have two videos out on timing. My YouTube channel is Baxrok2. The link to my crank pulley timing video that might help is here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5NzKdAQ4iI

Also, if Eric would like to provide an email address I can send him another timing video that might help. It will be out on YouTube soon. Two more to follow after that.

This "3oclock and 6oclock" stuff is not good enough. IMO, the best, and easiest, way to get the peg/crank relationship right is to remove the #1 spark plug. Put a rod in the #1 cylinder. Rotate the crankshaft until the #1 piston is just past BDC and on it's way up to TDC. Stop there. Put in the timing peg. Rotate the crankshaft until the weight contacts the peg. (you can hear it and feel it) TDC!

BEWARE: When you remove the crank pulley bolt from the crank shaft you WILL move the weight away from the peg and therefore off from TDC! So, you have to use the back of the crankshaft to verify TDC before tightening the crank pulley bolt! My upcoming videos show how this happens and how to avoid it.
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Nojodas67 03-16-2017 15:43
JohnC,
Eric's posts are here, just not at the end. He was replying to a post I made a couple years ago so Eric's posts are somewhere in the middle of this page, which is now pretty lengthy.

About setting the timing: It seems that Eric will be doing the timing BEFORE dropping the engine in the car, which is much easier than doing it in the car, so he will have access to the rear of his engine and the flywheel. When I was timing these engines, I made sure that the crank DID NOT rotate while loosening or tightening the crank bolt by locking the flywheel to the bell housing. I used a large C-clamp, some metal angle iron and a couple of bolts to make a bracket that locks the flywheel rock solid and prevents it from moving at all. If you aren't handy or creative, just use a pair of large quality vise grips to grab the flywheel ring-gear and put a bolt (transmission to bell-housing bolt) in place to use as a stop for the vise grips. That worked for me, until I made a flywheel-lockin g bracket.
I don't recommend using a pry-bar to hold the flywheel while tightening the crank bolt, because the pry-bar can slip...Done that :(
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Eric 03-16-2017 18:03
About setting the timing: It seems that Eric will be doing the timing BEFORE dropping the engine in the car, which is much easier than doing it in the car, so he will have access to the rear of his engine and the flywheel. When I was timing these engines, I made sure that the crank DID NOT rotate while loosening or tightening the crank bolt by locking the flywheel to the bell housing. I used a large C-clamp, some metal angle iron and a couple of bolts to make a bracket that locks the flywheel rock solid and prevents it from moving at all. If you aren't handy or creative, just use a pair of large quality vise grips to grab the flywheel ring-gear and put a bolt (transmission to bell-housing bolt) in place to use as a stop for the vise grips. That worked for me, until I made a flywheel-lockin g bracket.
I don't recommend using a pry-bar to hold the flywheel while tightening the crank bolt, because the pry-bar can slip...Done that :(
I practiced keeping the flywheel in place on my old engine and I'm really glad I did. I stuck a pry bar in the fly wheel and tried to loosen the crank bolt well as nojodas said, the pry bar slipped and since I had the M6 bolt holding the TDC position I broke the slot where the bolt screws in with the sudden turn of the crank bolt.
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johnc 03-16-2017 23:59
You practiced, that's pretty cool! I've heard that the timing cover can break from the M6 bolt. Bummer.
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johnc 03-17-2017 00:03
Thanks, I forgot how this blog works! I did look through the earlier comments but must have missed it.

Yes, much easier with engine out! In my upcoming videos I show the timing process and crankshaft moving away from TDC with the engine out. Then, I'll have two more that are more detailed about the tools, components, and step by step through the procedure. Should be better than my other video done in the car. On that one I was learning as I went!

Ah, yes, a flywheel-lockin g bracket, very smart sir! Great idea. Eric was very fortunate to have you instruct him on this! Good job guys!!
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Eric 03-17-2017 00:24
So I removed all the timing tools rotated the pully back slightly and then replaced the timing peg only. It's locked the crankshaft won't turn anymore and it seem as far as the pully and camshafts go they're both in position. Do you think it's all good?
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Nojodas67 03-17-2017 06:10
I'm not sure. It depends what stage of timing procedure you are in, I say this because proper tension of the chain is just as critical as proper crankshaft and camshaft angle. If you don't have even chain tension all the way around, the timing can still be off, even if the timing tools fit perfectly.
Eric, judging by your question, I really believe that you do not yet understand what proper timing is on these engines; before you go further, I think you have to watch a couple more videos...You're not quite ready yet. You CANNOT achieve proper timing unless you loosen BOTH camshaft bolts too (not just the crank bolt), set timing tools in place, and then torque camshaft bolts, and lastly torque the crankshaft bolt.
Watch these two videos, then read the steps below, which I just wrote again for you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBJ31S2WuaI#sthash.ZkLnpyzu.dpuf
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4jcoRG2Av0#sthash.ZkLnpyzu.dpuf
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Nojodas67 03-17-2017 06:12
Let me give you the steps, in a very simplified list so that maybe you get the whole picture: To prepare the donor Fusion engine for the swap, Before loosening either cam bolts and before loosening the crank bolt, do the following:
1) remove valve cover 2)rotate crankshaft so that #1 cyl is almost at TDC, verify engine is at compression stroke by checking that both intake and exhaust cam lobes are facing up and slightly leaning towards each other. If not, rotate crankshaft another full turn and check cam lobes again.
3)Lock flywheel with either method explained in previous posts (do not rely on pry bar or screw driver to keep crankshaft from turning) 4)Remove crank bolt and remove crank pulley and remove timing cover, but do not remove timing chain, unless you plan on replacing all (chain, gears, and chain tensioner)
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Nojodas67 03-17-2017 06:13
5)while holding the cams with open-end wrench, loosen both camshaft bolts a couple turns, but do not remove them. 6)Insert timing peg into hole on side of block and rotate crankshaft clockwise by turning flywheel until it doesn't turn anymore (#1 is now at TDC). 7) Fully seat cam-alignment tool (flat bar) into slots in back of cams (cams are now in correct rotation). 8)Grab VVT gear with gloves and rotate clockwise a few turns until chain tension is evenly spread through all gears (like in the videos). You are only rotating the 3 gears and chain, not the crankshaft nor camshafts, because all 3 bolts are loose. Verify chain is tight and has no play, otherwise replace chain, gears and tensioner together.
9)Observe notch on VVT gear for correct placement, like in the video. Hold intake cam tightly with open-end wrench and tighten cam bolt to torque spec, CRITICAL: CAMS MUST NOT ROTATE AT ALL DURING BOLT TIGHTENING. follow same procedure for exhaust cam bolt.
10) Install timing cover and insert Mazda pulley wheel (not Fusion pulley). 11) lock flywheel and torque crank pulley to spec.
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Nojodas67 03-17-2017 06:17
Again, these are simplified steps and I'm only going by memory. I haven't timed one of these engines for 2-3 years now. Follow the guide for more thorough and detailed instructions.

Because of this (asinine) keyless engine design, all 3 gears must be free to rotate (prior to tightening cam and crank bolts) or the chain won't have the same tension on all sides.
I hope this clears it up a bit more.

Note: step #2 refers to #1 cylinder cam lobes.
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Nojodas67 03-17-2017 06:31
One more thing. You already know that the flywheel has to be locked because any slip can break the M6 bolt slot. Also if you rely on the timing peg against the crank weight to hold the crank, during the final quarter turn tightening of the crank bolt, you will punch a nice big hole on the side of the aluminum block, guaranteed. So the flywheel must be locked solid.

Equally important is to hold the camshafts solid without slippage while tightening or loosening the bolts, or you will break the tail end of the crankshafts with the camshaft-alignm ent bar inserted. You must use the perfect size open end wrench to prevent slippage, but I forget the correct size wrench to use, perhaps someone else can contribute with that information.
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Eric 03-17-2017 06:45
Ok thanks for that info. I read nothing about removing the timing cover or adjusting the tension in the instructions. Seems I got a little more work to do then expected haha. but thanks a bunch I really appreciate it.
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Nojodas67 03-17-2017 06:59
Well, you don't really adjust the tension. By freeing all the gears, the tension adjusts itself. Removing the timing cover is necessary for swapping the intake camshaft, which was the case for most of these swaps when this blog was first started many years ago.
On a side note, the only way to check the wear on chain guides or how much the chain has stretched is to remove the timing cover. Remember, these are interference engines. #1 cause of failure for these engines is chains that have stretched beyond the tensioner's ability to remove the slack, then the chain jumps a few teeth. Then it's bye bye engine and hello engine swap. I've seen engines with only 60k miles blow up because of loose chains.
When I was doing these swaps, I always installed a new timing chain kit, especially since I had the cover off and it was right there...and just $85 on Ebay.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Timing-Chain-Kit-W-Oil-Drive-Set-for-MAZDA-3-6-CX-7-2-3L-MPS-L3K9-TURBO-07-13-/272500521337?fits=Make%3AMazda%7CEngine+-+Liter_Display%3A2.3L&hash=item3f724bf979:g:7K8AAOSwa~BYY0DJ&vxp=mtr
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Nojodas67 03-17-2017 06:34
Sorry, this sentence should read "or you will break the tail end of the camshafts..."
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Eric 03-17-2017 07:14
Man I don't know what I would have done without this site. So luckily I have the same intake camshaft so I won't need to swap that. So tomorrow I'll remove the timing cover and check everything out. One last thing do you know the torque specs for the cam bolts?
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Nojodas67 03-17-2017 07:31
Man...I used to have all those specs, I don't know where that stuff is anymore after the move. But that's easy information to find on the web.
Be sure to clean the mating surfaces well on both the block and timing cover, then just use a small bead of high-temp RTV sealant when you put the cover back on. If you plan on keeping the car, I'd definitely invest in a chain kit (chain kit for Fusion, not Mazda...the chains are different).
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Eric 03-17-2017 15:38
Thanks again.
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Chris Brown 03-19-2017 21:49
I'm in the middle of swapping an 09 fusion into my 05 Mazda 6. I am in the process of swapping over my intake camshaft however wen I put it in, the cam alignment tool would not go back in. This may be because the tool I have has holes that sit underneath one end of each cam shaft so they were not perfectly horizontal. I'm getting a tool without holes in it so it will be more accurate. So my intake cam shaft is about a tooth away from being inline with my exhaust cam and fitting in with the tool. I'm wondring if I rotate the cam over about an 8th of an inch it will be horizontal with my exhaust cam and fit the tool. Please let me know if I have done anything wrong so far. Also was me taking out my cam while they werent totally in line damaging in any way? Also wen I put my cam in, my engine cranked and compressed. Please let me know ASAP. THANK YOU
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Nojodas67 03-20-2017 00:20
Quoting Chris Brown:
I'm in the middle of swapping an 09 fusion into my 05 Mazda 6. I am in the process of swapping over my intake camshaft however wen I put it in, the cam alignment tool would not go back in. This may be because the tool I have has holes that sit underneath one end of each cam shaft so they were not perfectly horizontal. I'm getting a tool without holes in it so it will be more accurate. So my intake cam shaft is about a tooth away from being inline with my exhaust cam and fitting in with the tool. I'm wondring if I rotate the cam over about an 8th of an inch it will be horizontal with my exhaust cam and fit the tool. Please let me know if I have done anything wrong so far. Also was me taking out my cam while they werent totally in line damaging in any way? Also wen I put my cam in, my engine cranked and compressed. Please let me know ASAP. THANK YOU

YOU ARE DOING IT ALL WRONG. YOU NEED TO GO BACK TO THE BEGINNING OF THE GUIDE AND READ IT CAREFULLY AND WATCH THE VIDEOS. IF YOU JUST SKIM THROUGH THESE DIRECTIONS, YOU WILL CAUSE PERMANENT ENGINE DAMAGE...IT'S UP TO YOU.
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Chris 03-20-2017 00:58
I have tried to copy the video links you posted for Eric but they don't work the only one I could view was this one. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5NzKdAQ4iI.
If my engine cranks I have not yet caused permanent damage have I? Only intake cam is slightly out of position. And since I have taken chain and chain tensioner off I noticed you said to replace them. Why is that?
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Eric 03-20-2017 01:38
https://youtu.be/IL5P7wEIymM

https://youtu.be/S5NzKdAQ4iI

https://youtu.be/K4jcoRG2Av0

https://youtu.be/wBJ31S2WuaI
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Chris 03-20-2017 02:41
Thank you, I appreciate that very much.
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Nojodas67 03-20-2017 14:29
Chris,
I don't want to retype all the steps and procedure again. So scroll up a few posts and read posts starting with the one I wrote on 03-17-2017 06:10.
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Eric 03-29-2017 23:30
So I just finished the swap and it started up after a while of cranking (there was moisture in the intake part of the engine).
As of now it drives fine and I'm monitoring it closely to make sure I didn't miss a thing.
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Eric 03-29-2017 23:31
As for post swap notes here are a few things I ran into most have been covered already.
1. I have an 05 but my crankshaft is the same as the fusion so I avoided that work.

2. The timing cover was different it looks almost exactly the same but the mounting holes are slightly farther apart. The interior side is also slightly different.

3. Doing the timing with the timing cover off is so much easier as you can see how it all works and where the counter weight sits.

4. The oil pans are different. They look exactly alike except the 05 has an opening on the oil pan itself for the dipstick the Fusion has the dipstick run straight through the engine. I didn't realize this until I replaced the timing cover and tightened the crank pully. Since I'm a lazy person I drilled a hole in my old valve cover and used the fusion dip stick. Obviously this isn't a good idea since you're going to get different readings just giving an example as why you should read everything before starting.

5. Lastly what I noticed was that the camshaft sensor and VVT solenoid on the fusion engine where the same as mine so I kept the fusion ones since they were in much better condition. Pleas verify the part numbers if you do the same though.
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Eric 03-30-2017 04:10
And thanks to nojodas dude helped out a bunch.
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Nojodas67 03-30-2017 13:28
Quoting Eric:
And thanks to nojodas dude helped out a bunch.

You are welcome. I'm glad it worked out. But I've said it time and time again, if anyone follows this guide carefully and doesn't skip any steps, it will work.
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Eric 03-31-2017 06:28
Ok so I've come across a small issue. The car runs perfect, shifts great it and accelerates fine the only issue is when I start the car. The car starts up perfectly on occasion and sometimes it takes a few cranks. It doesn't sound like a battery or starter problem because it cranks fine. It sounds like it's cranking and it will want to start but won't then I do it aging and like magic it starts perfectly. I really hope the timing isn't off slightly because of all the work anybody have any ideas?
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Nojodas67 03-31-2017 15:28
Quoting Eric:
Ok so I've come across a small issue. The car runs perfect, shifts great it and accelerates fine the only issue is when I start the car. The car starts up perfectly on occasion and sometimes it takes a few cranks. It doesn't sound like a battery or starter problem because it cranks fine. It sounds like it's cranking and it will want to start but won't then I do it aging and like magic it starts perfectly. I really hope the timing isn't off slightly because of all the work anybody have any ideas?

Unfortunately, there is no way to accurately check the valve timing electronically. The valve cover, and passenger half-shaft have to be removed in order to use the timing tools to accurately check the timing. If you did the work yourself, and you know you did it right, then don't doubt yourself, it must be something else.
I would suspect fuel first. Check fuel pressure AND fuel volume with a pressure gauge while cranking. On cold starts, engines need a large amount of fuel when cold, about 10x volume than for an engine at operating temp. Fuel injected engines have no choke to limit air volume when cold, so injectors have to dump a very large amount of fuel into the cylinders in a cold engine. So I suggest cleaning the injectors, at the very least.
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Eric 03-31-2017 16:24
Thanks I'm going to check around to see if u see anything.
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Eric 04-02-2017 23:04
So I checked the codes and system and my evap monitoring is not ready. I'm guessing it might be a fuel leak somewhere causing the lack a fuel persuasive when starting?I need to do a thorough inspection when I get the chance sometime next week. My buddy also said he saw a spark near the intake manifold when we were first starting it so that might be something.
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Eric 04-06-2017 19:38
Ok so I narrowed down my starting issue. I cranked the car at different times and I noticed that the car hesitates after it loses pressure somewhere around the intake manifold. If I start it right after I turn it off it will start up just fine and continue to do so. Now, after I turn the car off after about 15 seconds there is a loud short hiss that comes from the front right side of the engine if I start the car anytime after that there's a guaranteed delay. I don't know if it's from the manifold itself or from something underneath it anyone have any ideas?
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Nojodas67 04-06-2017 20:49
Quoting Eric:
Ok so I narrowed down my starting issue. I cranked the car at different times and I noticed that the car hesitates after it loses pressure somewhere around the intake manifold. If I start it right after I turn it off it will start up just fine and continue to do so. Now, after I turn the car off after about 15 seconds there is a loud short hiss that comes from the front right side of the engine if I start the car anytime after that there's a guaranteed delay. I don't know if it's from the manifold itself or from something underneath it anyone have any ideas?
You said "loses pressure". Did you mean "fuel pressure"?
If so, it sounds like a leaking fuel injector. Take the fuel rail out with the injectors in place. Disable the ignition coil(s), place a large towel under the fuel injectors and crank the engine for a couple seconds (it shouldn't start). Then carefully watch the injectors for any fuel seepage...you will probably only see a slight seepage, not a gush of fuel. Injectors should not leak AT ALL even when the fuel rail is pressurized. If none of the injectors is leaking, I would then check for fuel leakdown in the fuel return check valve next, or fuel pressure regulator.
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Nojodas67 04-06-2017 20:52
While you have the injectors out of the head and attached to the fuel rail, it would be a perfect opportunity to check the fuel spray pattern. You'll need someone else to crank the engine while you watch each of the injectors spray on a bath towel. I hope you don't smoke :)
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Eric 04-06-2017 21:07
Well to be honest I don't know if it loses "pressure" I'm just assuming it loses some kind of air pressure. Because I hear the air hiss as if something is depressurizing like when you exhale with your tounge pressing against the roof of your mouth.
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johnc 04-07-2017 02:27
Quoting Eric:
Ok so I narrowed down my starting issue. I cranked the car at different times and I noticed that the car hesitates after it loses pressure somewhere around the intake manifold. If I start it right after I turn it off it will start up just fine and continue to do so. Now, after I turn the car off after about 15 seconds there is a loud short hiss that comes from the front right side of the engine if I start the car anytime after that there's a guaranteed delay. I don't know if it's from the manifold itself or from something underneath it anyone have any ideas?


Quoting Eric:
Well to be honest I don't know if it loses "pressure" I'm just assuming it loses some kind of air pressure. Because I hear the air hiss as if something is depressurizing like when you exhale with your tounge pressing against the roof of your mouth.


Part of the IMRC (intake manifold runner controls) is a vacuum actuator (one of two) that opens the flaps. One is directly under the TB and above the MAP sensor. On my son's 6 with the 2.3, 5 seconds or so after switching the engine off, the actuator will hiss for a second or two. (venting as it closes?) Check your vacuum lines in that area, the lines on the IMRC solenoids, the function of the solenoids, the electrical connector that goes to that actuator, etc,.
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Eric 04-07-2017 05:14
Thank you I'll check that.
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